Summon Myrmidon - raw legal permutations

[DHood64]

Can a summoned Myrmidon have IQ higher than 8?

If it has IQ 9, can it take non weapon talents like "Toughness" ?

Same question if spell was an Illusion of a summoned Myrmidon?

(given its 32 points many options are limited, just trying to understand legal permutations).

[Bill_in_IN]

Originally Posted by DHood64

Can a summoned Myrmidon have IQ higher than 8?

If it has IQ 9, can it take non weapon talents like "Toughness" ?

Same question if spell was an Illusion of a summoned Myrmidon?

(given its 32 points many options are limited, just trying to understand legal permutations).

It's my understanding that the summoned fighter cannot have any talents beyond the use of the basics needed for the weapons with which he is equipped and that his 32 attribute point combination allows.

[timm meyers]

The Myrmidon summon is very open to interpretation imho. The spell specifically states
"..if the wizard wishes, the Myrmidon can be any starting (32 point) fighter with any legal combination of regular weapons and armor...."
So must be a fighter not a wizard (although the summon magic myrmidon is a cool concept)
and "regular" weapons/armor seems pretty clear in intent that myrmidons cannot come equipped with fine +DX/Dam. swords or flaming weapons etc. Now does this mean they cannot come with peculiar weapons like net and trident or a bola? Answering this question first seems to be foundational to your question of talents such as toughness as many of the exotic weapon choices require different talents to operate.
(None of the above should be confused or shadowed by the Illusion spell limits of IQ 7 weapons talents as that is a completely different spell with different parameters of perception by the enemy see p.139)

Personally I think it is rude to ask players in the middle of a combat to please pause while they create or adjust a summoned fighter so they can somehow gain an advantage to the particular situation/enemy they are facing, instead of using the generic fighter listed.

However, if a player came to me as the GM with a set list of 32pt myrmidons that they wish to use during the campaign I would allow full use of any talents, weapons and or armor they wish to design into them. I am thinking maybe a half dozen different fighters predone and ready to deploy would both flavorful and nondisruptive. But honestly, I cannot think of the last time anyone used the spell...sigh...

(I have always imagined that magi make inroads or pacts with other dimensional worlds/planes of existence where they pull such summoned creatures from anyway....)

[hcobb]

I impose the limits of Melee on Summon Myrmidon. You get two weapons from the Melee list (a shield counts as a weapon), and a dagger, and the basic talents for those weapons.

[Axly Suregrip]

Originally Posted by hcobb

I impose the limits of Melee on Summon Myrmidon. You get two weapons from the Melee list (a shield counts as a weapon), and a dagger, and the basic talents for those weapons.

I do similar to the above with also allowing for any additional talents that a starting fighter may know. Except, no unusual weapons as they are not basic weapons.

You may want a fighter with a spear that knows Seamanship. This is a easy fighter to quickly draw up.

[hcobb]

Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip

You may want a fighter with a spear that knows Seamanship. This is a easy fighter to quickly draw up.

So it's a Summon Linguist spell?

[TippetsTX]

I'm completely the other direction. I want all 'myrmidons' to be the same. For me, the spell is accessing a universal warrior template, not some kind of custom-built cohort.

[Axly Suregrip]

Originally Posted by hcobb

So it's a Summon Linguist spell?

Talents, not languages

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by hcobb

I impose the limits of Melee on Summon Myrmidon. You get two weapons from the Melee list (a shield counts as a weapon), and a dagger, and the basic talents for those weapons.

I'm with Henry on this interpretation which goes back to the original Wizard microgame.

[larsdangly]

If the question is, how does this work RAW?, then I think it is obvious that any standard weapons and armor (things that appear on all the sub-sections of the equipment tables except possibly 'unusual weapons') are allowed, anything fine or magical is forbidden, and the 'unusual weapons' are at the GM's discretion, or consensus of all players if you are in a competitive arena combat situation.

This need for judgement is just one of countless instances where the specific choices of words in RAW are open to interpretation, so you have to make an interpretation - there is no 'correct' reading at the level of detail we are discussing.

But my 2 cents worth is that it is a bit nitpicky and too controlling to rule against use of most of the unusual weapons, like net and trident, spear thrower, lasso, etc. There is nothing particularly special about their material or construction, their use was widespread historically, and the only thing noticeably different from sword, axe, etc. is that they require a different talent to use proficiently. Yes, some of them have special rules to adjudicate their attacks, but the same is true of pole weapons.

Wizard's staff seems obviously contrary to the rule that your myrmidon has to be a fighter, not a wizard (though I suppose you could summon one holding another person's staff if you just wanted to watch them blow up!).

The tricky cases might be the gunpowder weapons, molotail and gas bomb. I feel like most GM's and play groups would agree they are out of bounds for a summoned myrmidon. But if it came up I'd have to give it a thought before I decided. A renaissance wizard summoning an arquibusier isn't actually a deranged idea, nor does it confer a particularly unbalancing advantage. But one with a petard seems to violate the spirit of the rule.