What's your iron threshold?

[hcobb]

Does putting a steel arrowhead into the body of a wizard give him a -4 for casting? Does carrying one or twenty steel arrows in his pack do the same?
Whataboutism one steel dagger?

[TippetsTX]

Wizards and iron... I like the restriction and the flavor it adds to the setting, but it's a bit too binary. I prefer a more nuanced approach.

• Minimal iron use (a few small held items, a dagger or two, arrows, bolts, etc.) - NO spellcasting penalty
• Light use (a sword or other metal weapons in moderation, reinforced leather, a buckler, bracers, etc.) - Cast at DX -2
• Moderate use (most metal-based armors, several iron weapons, small steel or large reinforced shields) - Cast at DX -4
• Heavy use (half or full plate, large steel or tower shields, etc.) - Cast at DX -6

Of course, using too many items from a lower category will bump you to the next one up and GMs may need to make individual rulings on certain combos.

[Drakenbow]

If arrows aren't enough to cause a DX loss to spell casting, then a bow and quiver as an alternate weapon would be a good choice along with boomerangs. Without knowing the full justification for the Iron-Wizard rule, I often viewed it as a body encasement issues and an issue with the hands not being able to project or manifest the spell's magical energy.

The rules has a comment about magnatism in the second sentence on p.140. But I do know many metals mess with transmission of a radio signal. Like consider how a satellite dish focuses a radio signal for transmission or for receiving. Encapsulate the actual antenna and the signal gets severly messed with.

[David Bofinger]

Originally Posted by Drakenbow

The rules has a comment about magnetism in the second sentence on p.140.

Specifically it mentions some ferromagnetic metals, though that might just be because it's generally the most powerful kind of magnetism.

Originally Posted by Drakenbow

But I do know many metals mess with transmission of a radio signal.

Metals block radio signals just because they are good conductors, they don't need to be magnetic. Different effect.

[Drakenbow]

Originally Posted by David Bofinger

Specifically it mentions some ferromagnetic metals, though that might just be because it's generally the most powerful kind of magnetism.



Metals block radio signals just because they are good conductors, they don't need to be magnetic. Different effect.

You are reading in a connection I didn't write. I'm a former telecommunications technician. My comment was very specific about reality on the second part of the relationship of metals and radia transmissions.

But there is a good reason why radio waves are part of the "electro-magnetic spectrum".

[DeadParrot]

Most of rules on Iron vs Magic center around weapons and armor. I would think that small items of iron won't mess up magic. After all, human blood has iron in it. Thinking along the lines of cloak clasp, belt buckle, boot eyelets, plate, cutlery set and mug for eating and drinking.

Is it just being around iron that is the problem? Will sitting at a table with iron plate wearing companions on either side mess up a wizard's magic? How about that iron plate of roast lizard the bar keep just set in front of the wizard?

Can you thwart magic by putting a wizard in a small iron cage? Or putting an iron collar around his neck? Or iron manacles on her wrists?

If iron has an Area of Effect for being anti-magic, what is it?

Maybe iron vs magic is a mental thing for a wizard. Trusting in iron for either damage or protection just messes with the wizard's mind and prevents using magic. So the iron arrowhead in his back won't create a -4 DX for casting but pulling it out Scorpion King style and reusing it as a weapon would.

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by DeadParrot

Or putting an iron collar around his neck? Or iron manacles on her wrists?

I play a thief/spy type character (he likes the term "professional") who carries a set of iron manacles and collar for the purpose of diminishing the threat wizards. There is at least as much iron in them as would be in a sword, so it should impose the full penalty. Plus it hinders gestures. A small iron ball wrapped in a rag makes a nice wizard gag.

[Drakenbow]

Originally Posted by DeadParrot

Is it just being around iron that is the problem? Will sitting at a table with iron plate wearing companions on either side mess up a wizard's magic? How about that iron plate of roast lizard the bar keep just set in front of the wizard?

Can you thwart magic by putting a wizard in a small iron cage? Or putting an iron collar around his neck? Or iron manacles on her wrists?

If iron has an Area of Effect for being anti-magic, what is it?

Good questions IMO. Enchanting an item of iron does not induce a penalty. It seems the "wearing" or "wielding" of it by the caster is the problem. Perhaps say affecting the caster's aura to channel magic into an effect.

I would say:
Iron Plate Lizard: No.
Sitting between plated tanks: No.
Small Iron Cage: Yes
Large Cage: Maybe not
Collar / Manacles: Yes.
Standing on a planet with a molten iron core: No.
Standing in a molten iron core: Yes.

But this is a good question about how much is needed and when it does affect the caster. Incremental steps by amount "carried"?

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by Drakenbow

Good questions IMO. Enchanting an item of iron does not induce a penalty. It seems the "wearing" or "wielding" of it by the caster is the problem. Perhaps say affecting the caster's aura to channel magic into an effect.

Or perhaps it has nothing whatsoever to do with the iron as a physical material but everything to do with the antagonism of iron arms and weapons and magic on the Plane of Symbols, or the hostility of the ironsmithing war god to magicians. Or maybe you can wear a massive iron decorative headdress with no effect (because it isn't an arm or armor) but wearing a helmet, or for that matter standing near your armed bodyguards, saps your power by showing your lack of confidence in magic to protect you.

Longstanding efforts in gaming (and some SF) to make the interaction of iron with magic make sense through scientific technobabble involving magnetic fields or electrical conductivity [always] fail, because frankly the effects just aren't large relative to all the other fields and conductive stuff around.

Trying to have an amount of iron you can carry seriously impact magic via any sort of electrical or magnetic effects without having a thunderstorm in the same county do worse just isn't viable. If the field from a random iron suit is too much, the natural field of the Earth shuts you down for sure. Similarly, the interference in EM transmission from a few kilograms of nearby iron pales in comparison to say the difference between whether the sun is up or not, as does anything its conductivity could do compared to the effect of the ground you are standing on being wet. And don't even try to work magic over a saltwater ocean. Let's not even think about power lines....

[Axly Suregrip]

ITL 140 states, "A wizard wearing ordinary iron or steel armor, or carrying an ordinary weapon, will suffer a -4 DX on any spell he attempts to cast."

The smallest ordinary weapon is a dagger. It weighs 0.2 lbs. That is my limit. If it weighs less than 0.2 lbs, it is not a problem.

So, that means their may be a problem once a wizard has 4 arrows in him. (20 arrows weigh 1.0 lbs). But that assumes the whole arrow is made of iron. Say it is 20% iron, then it will only be an issue when a wizard has taken 20 arrows. And assuming none where then snapped off or pulled out.

Or if you want the math to have a wider margin, then assume 40% of arrow weight or assume 0.1 lbs is the tolerable limit of iron. Either way the wizard is down to 10 arrows. With both it becomes 5 arrows.

This does mean it is okay for a wizard to use bows (not crossbows) without a penalty. As long as they carry no more than your prescribed limit of arrows.

Also, let's not ignore that stone, iron and bronze arrowheads are just as effective. It is more of a question of reusability. But if you want to follow the rules, stone or bronze arrowheads do -1 damage. This is now becoming a new issue.