Darkness and invisible Fire

[timm meyers]

last sentence of the spell reads.
"Torches, lights, etc., come back to life when the spell ends"

This certainly implies that "Extinguishes all artificial lights" (everything but the sun?) stated in the first sentence means they are snuffed out, kaput, no more, to magically reignite when the spell ends.

So yes I think fire mages and elementals really hate the darkness spell.....

[TippetsTX]

Originally Posted by timm meyers

So yes I think fire mages and elementals really hate the darkness spell.....

While I can understand the logic of that conclusion, I'm not sure I can accept it as the author's intent. It would certainly make the spell much more powerful (situationaly, of course) than it's IQ level and cost would imply.

If it was my job to add some clarity to things like this (which it isn't, but I've already started typing so I may as well finish the thought), I would rule that DARKNESS has no effect on Creation spells. Or that it just cannot extinguish magical fire.

[timm meyers]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

......It would certainly make the spell much more powerful (situationaly, of course) than it's IQ level and cost would imply.

If it was my job to add some clarity to things like this (which it isn't, but I've already started typing so I may as well finish the thought)...

(LOL cause I am already typing...I really liked that)

I think allot of rule interpretations get push back on an overly strict "power dynamic" because we (gamers) are all armchair strategists. The basic premise of comparing arms and costs of one unit to another unit and agreeing to the overall combat effectiveness is foundational to all wargames. We then simulate such a confrontation/match up with a ratio of success and throw in a chance factor to give us the result. The lopsided engagements are sure bets while equal matchups are at the mercy of the die roll. The RPG has a ton of added factors and the largest random factor of all "Players choices".

The chance matrix of the low 9 IQ, low ST cost spell, being effectively deployed against the higher IQ, heavier cost spell/creature is miniscule. So much so that I see the normal logic of unbalanced rules (cheaper/easier should not beat expensive/harder) to be irrelevant.

If a character whipped out a darkness spell on the final boss's fire elemental minions to try and attempt to kill him man to man... "Merlin, whatever you do keep that darkness spell going or we are surely dead!" I would hope I could lean into the spirit of the epic outcome and memory that fight would hopefully create.
or
What happens in the lands where the fire cult comes into power and begins hunting down all the darkness magi?
or
more likely what happens when after 30 years of playing the fire hex wizard that never encounters anyone who even knows the darkness spell because it is such a singular-focused spell and certainly never the equitable and cost balanced anti-fire magic rainstorm spell.

[Axly Suregrip]

I thought on this some more.

It is a "Darkness" spell and not an "extinguish fire" spell. The answer is in the name of the spell.

Darkening the flames but not putting them out. Like a large area affect Shadow spell. Thus we still have a need for Magic Rainstorm and Fireproofing.

[timm meyers]

Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip

I thought on this some more.

It is a "Darkness" spell and not an "extinguish fire" spell. The answer is in the name of the spell.

I hear you, even if the first word in the description is literally "Extinguishes..." the fact that they "...come back to life when the spell ends." means the fires are not permanently put out like dousing them with a rainstorm.

Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip

Darkening the flames but not putting them out. Like a large area affect Shadow spell. Thus we still have a need for Magic Rainstorm and Fireproofing.

or can just as easily be a 3rd magic that could effect hot situations? This is where I like the nuance of TFT magics as all 3 of these spells effect the same situation but each with their own results and or limitations.
Rainstorm- puts out any flame (real or magic) but is limited in area effect
Fireproofing- negates the effect of flames but only for one person
Darkness- Temporarily "removes" all light sources which includes the flames from torch, campfire or even an elemental / magic flame, but all return once the spell ceases.
This effect would never be preferred over either of the other 2 spells for a wizardly fire brigade but is an interesting bonus for the sneak thief who 99.9% of the time uses the darkness spell as cover.

[Draygon]

Obviously Darkness spells extinguish only light, but not the heat generated by the combustion of the fuel, which is a process of oxidation/ chemical breakdown.

[phiwum]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

While I can understand the logic of that conclusion, I'm not sure I can accept it as the author's intent. It would certainly make the spell much more powerful (situationaly, of course) than it's IQ level and cost would imply.

If it was my job to add some clarity to things like this (which it isn't, but I've already started typing so I may as well finish the thought), I would rule that DARKNESS has no effect on Creation spells. Or that it just cannot extinguish magical fire.

I think I'll go along with it temporarily extinguishing even magical fires. I don't think it makes the spell particularly powerful. It has a good use when fighting fire-using foes, but it's the kind of clever usage that I really like with spells that otherwise don't come up much.