[Ultra Tech] Increased Firearm Power with TL

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by DemiBenson

Maybe this is why at higher TL, people switch to systems that by design have lower felt recoil due to smoother propellant burning?

Or they compensate for the lower weight with bigger recoil buffers.

Or they use smaller calibers. How many people use .45 today?

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Or they use smaller calibers. How many people use .45 today?

Seeing as it's apparently ranked just behind 9mm Parabellum in sales of handgun rounds (I think .22LR beats both, but it's used for both handguns and rifles, and is rather more plinking-friendly than either of the others), my guess would be a lot, regardless of how much of the gun community is convinced it's just a small group of "Fudds" talking about "MUH STOPPING POWER!" and "TWO WORLD WARS!"

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Seeing as it's apparently ranked just behind 9mm Parabellum in sales of handgun rounds (I think .22LR beats both, but it's used for both handguns and rifles, and is rather more plinking-friendly than either of the others), my guess would be a lot, regardless of how much of the gun community is convinced it's just a small group of "Fudds" talking about "MUH STOPPING POWER!" and "TWO WORLD WARS!"

A better formulation of the question might have been 'how many people use a modern-strength .45-size cartridge', since the not-going-away legacy cartridge is significantly a product of an earlier TL. There are certainly some users of .45 ACP high-pressure loadings though.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

A better formulation of the question might have been 'how many people use a modern-strength .45-size cartridge',.

You would need to add together the sales for the .454 Casull and the Grizzly LAR. This isn't counting all the wildcats and rarities between the .45 ACP and the .50 rounds like the Desert eagle .50 AE and the S&W .500 magnum.

It's totally ignoring al the kinds of .44 Magnum rounds too.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

You would need to add together the sales for the .454 Casull and the Grizzly LAR. This isn't counting all the wildcats and rarities between the .45 ACP and the .50 rounds like the Desert eagle .50 AE and the S&W .500 magnum.

It's totally ignoring al the kinds of .44 Magnum rounds too.

Uh, I think all those wildcats and rarities and .50 rounds put together could be described with only a little unfairness as having zero usage.

.44 magnum is, of course, quite a bit smaller than .45 (it's actually under .43"), but might actually have noticeable popularity?

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

Uh, I think all those wildcats and rarities and .50 rounds put together could be described with only a little unfairness as having zero usage.

.44 magnum is, of course, quite a bit smaller than .45 (it's actually under .43"), but might actually have noticeable popularity?

http://knowledgeglue.com/what-are-th...ers-in-the-us/

......seems to have .44 Magnum as the 15th most popular caliber in the US with 1.4% of the market. With 2018 numbers of 8.1 billion rounds sold in the US that should come to over 100 million rounds sold in one year.

That probably counts as significant to the ammo makers. Even some of those calibers you want to count as "zero" are probably significant.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

http://knowledgeglue.com/what-are-th...ers-in-the-us/

......seems to have .44 Magnum as the 15th most popular caliber in the US with 1.4% of the market. With 2018 numbers of 8.1 billion rounds sold in the US that should come to over 100 million rounds sold in one year.

That probably counts as significant to the ammo makers. Even some of those calibers you want to count as "zero" are probably significant.

So the statistics you came up with are about firearm sales, not ammo sales, and it's risky to assume that those have the same proportions...

But also, the extended chart shows the first even 20th century loading larger than .44 magnum (which is somehow .50 BMG!) having sales less than a fifth of .44 magnum. The rounds you actually talked about start just above a tenth. Of the 1.4%. I'm comfortable calling that negligible use. (.50 BMG of course has plenty of military use, but I don't think that's what we're talking about here.)

(Also, why is "significant to ammo makers" a thing I'm supposed to care about?)

[Rupert]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

http://knowledgeglue.com/what-are-th...ers-in-the-us/

......seems to have .44 Magnum as the 15th most popular caliber in the US with 1.4% of the market. With 2018 numbers of 8.1 billion rounds sold in the US that should come to over 100 million rounds sold in one year.

That probably counts as significant to the ammo makers. Even some of those calibers you want to count as "zero" are probably significant.

That seems to be based on gun sales, not ammo sales. I expect that they won't be quite the same - if nothing else most people with .454 Casulls (#48) and the Weatherbys probably won't be putting that many rounds through them each year.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Or they use smaller calibers. How many people use .45 today?

Among civilians in the US market? A lot.

Of course this can't be easily separated into ammo (.45 ACP) and platform (M1911-style pistols). M1911-style pistols in 9 mm have become a thing.

Anyway, .45 ACP is not going away any time soon. Few ammo types do. There are still people shooting .45-70.

[DemiBenson]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Or they use smaller calibers. How many people use .45 today?

Despite everyone below pointing out that .45 is still popular in the US today, I think Anthony is correct over large time scales - since the introduction of gunpowder, both personal weapons and battlefield weapons have generally shown a reduction in caliber and an increase in chamber pressure.

What percentage of hunters today hunt with musket-ball-sized ammunition? How many battlefield long-arms use musket-ball-sized ammunition?