Character Advancement

[weby]

I think that my players in the previous GURPS campaign might disagree with the "No character advancement".

The campaign was a fantasy "From starting bumbling heroes to minor gods"

They started at 100 points and ended up above 5000 points during the campaign consisting of 411 sessions and about 3300 hours of play time.

I gave out a base of 1 point/play hour and an additional bonus for completing campaign and character objectives. The bonuses amounted to about +50% to the total in the long run.

You can read the basic rundown of the progress and such in: http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=169711

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by fridayparson

While I'm sure some reading this may want to snap off a "git guud scrub" or a "if you don't like GURPS gtfo", I was hoping someone may have a homebrew solution, or any other advice I can use to get my group excited about GURPS again?

If the problem is that their characters don't grow fast enough you can (a) simply assign whatever traits are suitable and justifiable based on the character's experiences during play or (b) give them whatever amount of points y'all find generates the expected growth speed. If (b), and the group is expecting something like D&D's growth speed, I'd suggest starting out by multiplying the default point awards by 5 and then adjusting from there to suit your group's taste.

[Black Leviathan]

GURPS advancement is slow. It doesn't feature rapid rises to power like D&D. Instead it creates a more realistic growth for a person. When I say "Realistic" I don't mean to say that your desire for faster character growth is bad or wrong, just that exceeding that recommended CP per game will increasingly make character development make less sense. Regardless of how much CP you hand out, most advantages are a reflection of aptitude rather than advancement and really shouldn't be "learned".

If your players want big increases, a good solution might be to just hand them cool powers. Give them equipment that makes them powerful or let them get strange abilities through wishes or cosmic empowerment.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Black Leviathan

GURPS advancement is slow. It doesn't feature rapid rises to power like D&D. Instead it creates a more realistic growth for a person. When I say "Realistic" I don't mean to say that your desire for faster character growth is bad or wrong, just that exceeding that recommended CP per game will increasingly make character development make less sense. Regardless of how much CP you hand out, most advantages are a reflection of aptitude rather than advancement and really shouldn't be "learned".

Maybe this is true to reality. Maybe. But it's not true to lots of gaming worlds and a number of fictional ones. And there's absolutely nothing about GURPS that compels you hew to that maybe-realistic theory of growth.

[mehrkat]

an alternative rule that i've allowed in my game that creates an advancement is that players can reformat points to increase attributes.

So say a character has 10 4 point intelligence skills they can pull 2 points from each of them to make 20 points and add a point of IQ. The points pulled must not lower any skill but then IQ is now one point higher and all skills are recalculated. I do that in essentially all games that starts at a low point level.

[Toptomcat]

Originally Posted by Rupert

That depends on how long it runs...

I've been handing out points on a diminishing scale for some years now (3/session under 400 points, 2/session <800, 1/session at 800+), and have a couple of 1200-point PCs. Even disallowing explicitly cinematic advantages, they are monsters in their way.

Huh. What does a 'not explicitly cinematic' 1200-pt character look like?

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Toptomcat

Huh. What does a 'not explicitly cinematic' 1200-pt character look like?

They probably can't do anything that would be impossible for a human to do, while being an expert at a wide range of subjects, enough to compete with the best in nearly any field of endeavour.

[Eric Funk]

Originally Posted by fridayparson

The problem lies in that most of the coolest stuff are things like Advantages, most of which one can't get after creation and stat increases are prohibitively expensive.

Depending what kind of setting you have it is your job as GM to determine what kind of advancement your "team" can have with their chosen character concepts and how they will "train" up and "level" up. You can consider "leveling" an idea that a new advantage might be available to a warrior (or access to a new spell tree, etc). Without knowing anything about your campaign setting I can't give specific suggestions.



If it is a dungeon fantasy setting, I suggest looking into the GURPS "GURPS Dungeon Fantasy"* set of products at e23. They have gone to the trouble to package standard classes and give "next level" suggestions for class and race.
Say a warrior might learn High Pain Threshold, or a dwarf might learn some Magic Resistance (Switchable). Also remember that not all awards are "tangible", such as patrons, reputation, Rank (B499)

A "levelup" scenario can often be represented as some sort of advanced training appropriate to your setting between adventures (visit the dojo, combat sim, wizard tower, commune with the otherworldly powers). (See the advice around "Controlling Character Development" p.B499)



Stat increases are expensive?

Note that it is permitted secondary characteristicscan vary by 30% off base (B16). With GM advice an adventurer can buy them in parcels for incremental benefits until complete.

ST - base 10/level
You can start it with
+1 HP 2cp (B16)
+1 Striking ST

IQ - base 20/level
You can start with
CORE IQ: 10/level ( no Will, Per)
then add +1 Will, Per for 5cp each and you can match with "Stock IQ"


the next two are intertwined for Speed/Move
DX: Base 10/level
Start with
+1 Basic Move (B17) [5]
+0.25 Basic Speed
And optionally Higher Manual Dexterity 5/level (B59) (if a PC would benefit)

HT: Base 10/level
Also +1 FP (3/level)



* (I say it this way as I personally prefer the GURPS "GURPS Dungeon Fantasy" product in contrast to the "Dungeon Fantasy (Powered by GURPS)" also available but still refer to the latter for all the work to gather rules together.

[RGTraynor]

While it's been three years, and the OP was the only post the person ever made, I have an extraordinarily hard time wrapping my head around the nonsensical statement of "In other words after 20 sessions a GURPS character is basically the same." We're talking what, 40 points for a mediocre player in a campaign where not a whole lot happens? That's quite a lot of advancement. (Never mind that if the players really, honestly, have to go newbie-to-superhero overnight, for pity's sake, just hand over 5x XP a session or something.) Then again, I also have a heretical take on things:

For many years I was in a combat fantasy LARP, playing a priest-mage (for lack of a simpler term). By 1994, I maxed out all the spells the system would allow me to have and still carry a sword of an effective length. In that season, I was 34 years old and was just about as effective a fighter as my gradually deteriorating knees and wrists would allow me to be. I was, by that time, also a prince at the head of my own nation, and the most prominent ritual magician in the game.

I played for eight more years and about 150 events, never advancing one jot further. Social progress only came with the retirement of other players; of the several of us who were major leaders, all but one of us was in place for several years, and the longest standing one was a Queen for nearly 15 years. Meanwhile, I wasn't getting any younger, and gradually made the move from being a front line-capable fighter to an archer because my joints and hand strength weren't reliable enough any more.

In short, I didn't "advance." Few people, once they'd learned their quota of spells and gotten past newbie stage with a weapon, ever did. Somehow we managed to have fun nonetheless. Who knew?

[rkbrown419]

Rewards for the PC's don't have to just be points, cash or gear. When the party saves a town or two they should develop a Reputation advantage in addition to bonus points. You want to boost the players abilities into more cinematic territory have them meet a teacher who gives them a crash course that qualifies them for Trained by a Master. After a few jobs for a wealthy employer have the relationship evolve into the Patron advantage. Adventures can reward your PC's in any way you can imagine as long as it makes sense in your setting and they story you're telling. Of course the reverse is true as well. Injuries can leave characters maimed if you're using those rules. A colossal foul up in front of witnesses can provide a negative reputation. If your players liked a particular antagonistic NPC who didn't end up an absolutely confirmed kill can become an Enemy popping up again and again. It all depends on what kind of game you want to run.