[DF] "But I'm a (half) angel!"

[Kromm]

GURPS Dungeon Fantasy assumes a dirty, gritty kind of fantasy where even the "cute" halflings and leprechauns are, respectively, gangsters and foul-tempered little brutes. Everybody is looking out for #1, which is why the saintliest clerics still accept payment in gold procured through theft and murder. As the (brief) rules for social order in GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 2: Dungeons suggest, the authorities are harsh, unforgiving, and prone to dishing out corporal punishment. This is the context for celestials.

Turning to the racial write-up: "Some people believe that celestials exist for a Reason and are the Chosen. However, if divine servitors are forbidden to fraternize with mortals – as clerics claim – then it seems more likely that celestials descend from rebel angels, or that angels aren't divine servitors." Which is to say that the prevailing belief is that celestials are the offspring of fallen angels who can't keep their pants up. They get exactly the same amount of slack as anybody else with +1 to reactions thanks to Attractive, but not one iota more. Their racial feature of counting as Good has nothing to do with how they're perceived in mundane interactions; it's a technicality or loophole in cosmic law that hinders as often as it helps, and only matters in supernatural affairs. Only some fool who relies entirely on Detect Evil spells would let that influence him.

In short, ordinary people in the dog-eat-dog environment assumed in DF generally acknowledge that celestials are pretty. Beyond that, any awe they might feel is balanced by an apprehension that angels are dangerous, mercurial, and maybe a bit rapey. Thus, celestials don't get a free pass. And note that the author is well aware of the Honest Face perk, which he gave to gnomes and halflings so that they could live in polite society despite being known to be gifted thieves and kleptomaniacs, respectively. Celestials don't have this because they're at least as likely as anyone else to draw blame when things go wrong . . . maybe more so, when things go supernaturally wrong or someone experiences virgin birth.

If a player wants a "can do no wrong" celestial, then by all means let her buy Honest Face. Agents, assassins, bards, cutpurses, innkeepers, servants, and thieves all have it as a standard option, allowing sketchy people who are card-carrying members of the demimonde, lowborn classes, and underworld to hang out with holy warriors and get audiences with kings. Perhaps more pertinently, it's suggested for clerics of love, who also have holy ties with a decidedly carnal shadow.

[roguebfl]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

Lucifer was still capable of assuming a fair seeming appearance.

"Fairest and fallen, greeting and defiance!" (a wizard's standard greeting to the Lone Power in Diane Duane's Young Wizards series)

"under the general rule that they can be opposed to the crap It pulls without being rude to it. The goal, after all, is to get It to stop acting out and go home, and who knows, in the long run being polite may help…" —Diane Duane

[dcarson]

The Perks Convincing Nod and Honest Face would work well together for someone that people won't suspect of doing anything wrong.

[Vynticator]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

Lucifer was still capable of assuming a fair seeming appearance.
.

Geeky aside: In Milton, Lucifer is amazed and dismayed that the real Angels don't recognize him after his Fall. "If thou beest he, but O how fall'n! how changed!" etc. Sure, he can shapechange, and Adam and Eve don't see through his disguises, but the Angels see through him right away and in Hell, the fallen angels hardly recognise one another. Plus they can take damage: unfallen angels can't.

Still, DF is a silly format and I guess you have to overlook the absurdity that an actual angel would go dungeon crawling for loot, so hey, whatever suits your format/world. If there are Celestials who go grubbing around for gold and murder merrily for the challenge, I guess they would have a less robust reputation for innate goodness?

[Vynticator]

Ah. I see Kromm pretty much covered my second paragraph in his post. I should really read the whole thread before posting, huh?

[GodBeastX]

Just gonna throw this out there too.

In D&D the "Celestial Blooded" (Aasimar, Half-Celestials, etc) are often greater mistreated than Humans. You know, because people don't like different, and seeing something with weird eye colors or feathers instead of hair, etc, can be off putting.

Villager A: "Why are monsters attacking us?"

Villager B: "That dude with the gold eyes probably dragged them in!"

Celestial: "Yo, I'm half celestial! No way!"

Villager A: "Do you got a business card to prove that?"

Villagers don't have "Hidden Lore" to know what a celestial is, or means really.

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by Railstar

As far as their Advantages allow - I would say if someone wanted to make this an important character element, take Social Regard or Reputation. Be generous with letting the player take these things if they want to spend points in that direction, but ultimately the player decides if they want them and they will not be freebees.

Social Regard is what fits the concept. It also can't be taken away from the character. It's an intrinsic part of the category that the character visibly belongs to, without the moral conduct of the individual character being at all relevant.

Reputation can rise (if under +4) and fall according to actions, and is tied to the individual.

But this also means that Social Regard can't reasonably be purchased after gamestart, if it comes from the character's species. It'll have to be present from the start, throughout the character's entire life, people he encounters always reaction to him at this bonus of +X. Social Regard can also come from something non-biological, such as being old, and that can be purchased. It's just not reasonable when it's species-derived.

[Kromm]

I'm not so sure that in a setting with overt supernatural elements on every street corner, it wouldn't make sense to purchase racial Social Regard in play . . .

Maybe angels/half-angels/half-demons/demons have some visible indicator of their Goodness or Evilness that changes with their deeds. Angelic types who do good deeds and protect life get progressively shinier, or acquire a visible halo. Demonic types who engage in treachery and destruction start withering small plants and making animals bay. The ability to change in this way is a 0-point racial feature, and perhaps all that distinguishes (part-)angel from (part-)demon is what they've been doing to trigger this feature.

In that case, points earned doing Good stuff could be spent on Social Regard (Respected) and points earned doing Evil stuff could be spent on Social Regard (Feared). Since Evil is customarily an "easier" path than Good, maybe being Feared could be paid for in part by taking Frightens Animals, Lifebane, and similar dark traits.

And needless to say, in a setting where a class of entities physically manifests incontrovertible symbols of their Good and Evil deeds, common folk will recognize and react to those symbols in much the same way they eat some mushrooms but avoid others, or trust proven healers more than necromancers who travel by zombie-borne sedan chair.

[GodBeastX]

Originally Posted by Kromm

I'm not so sure that in a setting with overt supernatural elements on every street corner, it wouldn't make sense to purchase racial Social Regard in play . . .

Maybe angels/half-angels/half-demons/demons have some visible indicator of their Goodness or Evilness that changes with their deeds. Angelic types who do good deeds and protect life get progressively shinier, or acquire a visible halo. Demonic types who engage in treachery and destruction start withering small plants and making animals bay. The ability to change in this way is a 0-point racial feature, and perhaps all that distinguishes (part-)angel from (part-)demon is what they've been doing to trigger this feature.

In that case, points earned doing Good stuff could be spent on Social Regard (Respected) and points earned doing Evil stuff could be spent on Social Regard (Feared). Since Evil is customarily an "easier" path than Good, maybe being Feared could be paid for in part by taking Frightens Animals, Lifebane, and similar dark traits.

And needless to say, in a setting where a class of entities physically manifests incontrovertible symbols of their Good and Evil deeds, common folk will recognize and react to those symbols in much the same way they eat some mushrooms but avoid others, or trust proven healers more than necromancers who travel by zombie-borne sedan chair.

I know I saw a feature of angels being that their wings turned red, black and dingy colors if they did evil in some settings.

[Ashtagon]

That reminds me of an old SF story where some university students summoned a demon, but managed to knock it unconscious and drag it off to a hospital. The hospital psychiatrists had a little chat, and a little while later, the angel was cured...

The plot-line was that a demon is just a sick angel. The other plot-line was that this proved the existence of the supernatural, and caused the global multivac to shut down in a puff of logic.