[RPM] [Sorcery] Merging the Systems

[PK]

Originally Posted by Varyon

While it's a solid system, it's not what I'm looking for, as it still requires the ritual be built twice, in two different ways - as an RPM Ritual, and as a Power. The Power still functions differently from a Ritual - the example Fireball doesn't have the option of being delivered via touch. I want something where you can build the ritual once, as an RPM Ritual, and allow the character to pay points to make it an innate part of themselves rather than a ritual they have to gather energy for.

Unfortunately, there's really no direct conversion between RPM energy and the GURPS advantage system. So if you really want to "convert" between the two like that, you've got to do the following:

1. Accept that what you're doing is going to be 100% fiat.

2. Decide which of the two is your standard. Are you going to build every spell as an RPM ritual, or are you going to build every spell as a sorcery ability?

3. Come up with some ratio between the two that seems to produce fairly sane results.

4. Playtest, playtest, playtest, and keep tweaking step 3's ratio -- or come up with a more complex formula ("full cost = 11 + (energy/8.4)") -- until you get the results you want.

I'm afraid that I don't have any specific answers for you past step 1.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Pah, the meatbags should know by now that you're an AI designed for churning out Pyramid articles.

And soon...books. Sooo many books. As many as I can as much as I can. :-)

Originally Posted by Varyon

That version (which I hadn't noticed before, so thanks for pointing it out) is essentially the same as the RPM+Sorcery system I quoted PK on, with some minor nuances added in. While it's a solid system, it's not what I'm looking for, as it still requires the ritual be built twice, in two different ways - as an RPM Ritual, and as a Power. The Power still functions differently from a Ritual - the example Fireball doesn't have the option of being delivered via touch. I want something where you can build the ritual once, as an RPM Ritual, and allow the character to pay points to make it an innate part of themselves rather than a ritual they have to gather energy for. It's meant to continue functioning exactly as an RPM Ritual.

Originally Posted by PK

Unfortunately, there's really no direct conversion between RPM energy and the GURPS advantage system. So if you really want to "convert" between the two like that, you've got to do the following:

1. Accept that what you're doing is going to be 100% fiat.

2. Decide which of the two is your standard. Are you going to build every spell as an RPM ritual, or are you going to build every spell as a sorcery ability?

3. Come up with some ratio between the two that seems to produce fairly sane results.

4. Playtest, playtest, playtest, and keep tweaking step 3's ratio -- or come up with a more complex formula ("full cost = 11 + (energy/8.4)") -- until you get the results you want.

I'm afraid that I don't have any specific answers for you past step 1.

I'm afraid that PK has the right of it here. It's like trying to turn fruit juice back into fruit. It's easily done one way (Sorcery > RPM), but not so much the other (RPM > Sorcery). Good luck. :-)

[Qhaysh]

So... What about the points->energy conversion ratio? Any guesses as to what would be a reasonable number?

[Raekai]

Originally Posted by Qhaysh

So... What about the points->energy conversion ratio? Any guesses as to what would be a reasonable number?

Well, I would start with Energy Reserve X (One Ritual Only, -80%) [X] numbers. You just need some other way of regenerating your Energy Reserve really freaking fast or upping the cost of the Sorcery-Ritual-Advantage in order to make up for that. But, anyway, my point is that I would start there.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by PK

1. Accept that what you're doing is going to be 100% fiat.

Done.

Originally Posted by PK

2. Decide which of the two is your standard. Are you going to build every spell as an RPM ritual, or are you going to build every spell as a sorcery ability?

The former.

Originally Posted by PK

3. Come up with some ratio between the two that seems to produce fairly sane results.

This is, of course, my current issue. Some experimentation indicates (energy/2) is about right - it overcharges for some spells (like Amplify Injury or Death Touch - these would be around [15] each with Sorcery, but are [32] and [24], respectively, under my proposal), undercharges for some (Fireball would be [13] with Sorcery, and is [9] with my system), and is just right for some others (Air Jet and Alertness are [9] and around [7], respectively, in both systems).

Originally Posted by PK

4. Playtest, playtest, playtest, and keep tweaking step 3's ratio -- or come up with a more complex formula ("full cost = 11 + (energy/8.4)") -- until you get the results you want.

Yeah, I was hoping for some ideas to get close to something workable before going to this step. A more complex formula - particularly one that is different for different builds - might get us something very close to perfectly accurate, but would be annoying and probably negate the whole point of simply converting energy->character points.

Originally Posted by Raekai

Well, I would start with Energy Reserve X (One Ritual Only, -80%) [X] numbers. You just need some other way of regenerating your Energy Reserve really freaking fast or upping the cost of the Sorcery-Ritual-Advantage in order to make up for that. But, anyway, my point is that I would start there.

An interesting concept. That's [0.6]/level, and would be set up as an Alternate Ability to 80% of the cost of Magery and Ritual Adept (as in the process you're essentially reducing those to One Ritual Only). I've always felt that burning 1 FP for an "instant" energy gathering is probably fair, so you're arguably hovering close to my (energy/2) guideline, although recharging is likely going to either cost more than 1 FP or take longer than being merely instant. It appears I'm in the right ballpark - (energy/1.5) might be closer to the mark, but (energy/2) makes the math a lot easier.

[Randyman]

It has occurred to me that a merging of the two systems would look very similar to the system in GURPS Voodoo: The Shadow War.