Native TL for Eberron characters

[NecessaryWeevil]

I apologize if this has already been discussed but I'm new to the forum and I don't have time to search through the many, many results I get from searching.

My D&D 3.5 Eberron campaign ended with a massive Necromantic explosion that ripped holes in reality and dumped them into our new GURPS dimension-hopping campaign. We're going to switch DMs but as the one with a passing familiarity with GURPS, I'm up first.

So, my question is: some of the players want to play a version of their Eberron character. What is their native TL? I'd say Eberron is TL 4 without magic, but the widespread use of magic with bound elementals etc. lets them achieve TL 5 or 6 effects in many areas. What is the native TL of a character from that game? If it's 5 or 6, is that perfectly compatible with TL 5 or 6 from our own timeline? Also, I intend to start the campaign as one in which they bounce from timeline to timeline without any (initially) apparent logic or control. What is the inherent TL for the purposes of making them pay advantage points if they're above it?

Also, one is contemplating playing a lich. What happens when he goes to a low- or no- mana area? Does he simply fall apart and cease to exist? Or do I assume he's fine unless he explicitly takes some sort of magic dependency?

Sorry if these are stupid questions but I've been away from GURPS for a while!

[Turhan's Bey Company]

Originally Posted by NecessaryWeevil

What is their native TL? I'd say Eberron is TL 4 without magic, but the widespread use of magic with bound elementals etc. lets them achieve TL 5 or 6 effects in many areas. What is the native TL of a character from that game? If it's 5 or 6, is that perfectly compatible with TL 5 or 6 from our own timeline?

This is where the TLx+y notation comes in. For example, if they can routinely achieve TL6-like effects, but their technology diverges from ours at around TL4, they're TL4+2. You'll want to reread the material in Basic Set: Campaigns about technology.

Originally Posted by NecessaryWeevil

Also, I intend to start the campaign as one in which they bounce from timeline to timeline without any (initially) apparent logic or control. What is the inherent TL for the purposes of making them pay advantage points if they're above it?

Basically, you pick a TL, based on your perceptions and expectations of what the most common TL is likely to be.

Originally Posted by NecessaryWeevil

Or do I assume he's fine unless he explicitly takes some sort of magic dependency?

This. Significant dependencies and vulnerabilities should be written into the character's traits, and there's a Dependency disadvantage which covers precisely this case.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by NecessaryWeevil

I apologize if this has already been discussed but I'm new to the forum and I don't have time to search through the many, many results I get from searching.

My D&D 3.5 Eberron campaign ended with a massive Necromantic explosion that ripped holes in reality and dumped them into our new GURPS dimension-hopping campaign. We're going to switch DMs but as the one with a passing familiarity with GURPS, I'm up first.

So, my question is: some of the players want to play a version of their Eberron character. What is their native TL? I'd say Eberron is TL 4 without magic, but the widespread use of magic with bound elementals etc. lets them achieve TL 5 or 6 effects in many areas.

They're TL 4 for this purpose. While Eberron would probably have a higher level of base income than is normal for TL 4, that isn't relevant for a dimension-hopping campaign where they are starting with the possessions they were carrying when they left the previous campaign. They aren't going to be able to fix or use non-Eberron advanced technology. They probably couldn't even fix Eberron magitech since that's an NPC class. Nor are they going to be particularly good at first aid by comparison with TL 4 cultures.

As for setting the TL of the campaign, the simplest approach is to set it at the level that most of the PCs will be at.

[Phantasm]

Our e6 (variant d20 system) Eberron game is based mostly in and around Sharn and the Mournlands. So far, I'd put the basic TL at 4+2 or 3+3; effectively TL6 (Old West/Victorian England), but with its own unique magitech flavor.

Also note that the setting itself might have aspects of its TL which are advanced or retarded than what the baseline calls for. Basic Set: Campaigns uses Transportation, Weapons & Armor, Power, and Biotechnology/Medicine, and I'm willing to add Civil Engineering to the mix as well. Eberron's Weapons & Armor seem to have stalled out at TL4 or TL 3+1 (depending on how much of an impact you figure guns played in TL advancement in this area). The Power and Transportation aspects are easily equal to TL6, though divergent at some point due to magic (bound elementals replacing steam-power for locomotives and airships). Biotech/Medicine is also divergent due to healing magic, but I have no clue as to whether they have germ theory or blood typing, so it could be that it's still at effective TL4.

The city of Sharn is an engineering masterpiece, thanks to magic, which makes it equal in a lot of ways to New York City in the early 20th Century, only instead of building out they kept building up! TL6 construction, hands-down.

So TL 6 diverging at TL 3, but retarded in Weapons and Armor, and possibly Biotech/Medicine.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

They're TL 4 for this purpose. While Eberron would probably have a higher level of base income than is normal for TL 4, that isn't relevant for a dimension-hopping campaign where they are starting with the possessions they were carrying when they left the previous campaign. They aren't going to be able to fix or use non-Eberron advanced technology. They probably couldn't even fix Eberron magitech since that's an NPC class. Nor are they going to be particularly good at first aid by comparison with TL 4 cultures.

As for setting the TL of the campaign, the simplest approach is to set it at the level that most of the PCs will be at.

The Eberron Artificer is a PC class.

While my first take was TL4+2 I'm thinking TL6^ might be closer. Eberron doesn't look like TL4 with exotic advancements. It looks and acts as if it were TL6 in most respects. It just doesn't have the same limited physical laws as our world. I mean Sharn has 2000' tall towers and sir taxis.

You could call some half-orc from the backcountry straight TL3 but a sophisticate from Sharn would be more at home on Gernsback (TL6^) than a New Yorker from our TL6 would be.

It's really only Eberron's weapons and armor that are TL4 and the technomagic tends to confuse that issue.

The details of how this interacts on particular worlds would be hard to handle going by RAW alone. This is why GMs are given almost unlimited discretion. you'll be using yours so much I'd say not to sweat the details.

[warellis]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

The Eberron Artificer is a PC class.

While my first take was TL4+2 I'm thinking TL6^ might be closer. Eberron doesn't look like TL4 with exotic advancements. It looks and acts as if it were TL6 in most respects. It just doesn't have the same limited physical laws as our world. I mean Sharn has 2000' tall towers and sir taxis.

You could call some half-orc from the backcountry straight TL3 but a sophisticate from Sharn would be more at home on Gernsback (TL6^) than a New Yorker from our TL6 would be.

It's really only Eberron's weapons and armor that are TL4 and the technomagic tends to confuse that issue.

The details of how this interacts on particular worlds would be hard to handle going by RAW alone. This is why GMs are given almost unlimited discretion. you'll be using yours so much I'd say not to sweat the details.

Since when did TL6^ use fire elementals to power steam locomotives, or use airnelementals to generate lift? They're a magitech society which implies TL X + Y.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by warellis

Since when did TL6^ use fire elementals to power steam locomotives, or use airnelementals to generate lift? They're a magitech society which implies TL X + Y.

Technically Eberron doesn't do any of those. There's no steam power and the lift comes from magic wood. Air or fire elementals provide thrust for the flying ships.

TL X+Y is built on "based on TL X but having capabilities of TL Y". The highest tech areas of Eberron aren't based on TL4 tech. Their flying ships don't use sails. They use magically powered jet engines.

They also live in skyscrapers not castles. Not even Renaissance star-forts.

TL4 doesn't have any kinds of trains either.

Nah, Eberron didn't take a left turn at TL4 with the discovery of magic. It had magic from the start and has achieved a form of TL6 that looks and works very much like mundane technology.