Improving the Tonfa

[Gollum]

Originally Posted by Sindri

What is unimpressive is the GURPS tonfa. That represents a tonfa of traditional construction. GURPS doesn't penalize wooden weapons shifted to plastic construction and it probably shouldn't though it's possible cheap examples exist. Not to mention that there are police tonfa made of hard wood.

I hope the policemen don't know how to use them effectively then... Or know how to use them much more effectively than I can to avoid harming people (which is not hard, actually; I'm just a beginner in kobudo).

Oh, I forgot to tell...

Some people think that tonfas are that:
http://www.google.fr/imgres?imgurl=h...ed=0CCoQrQMwAg

They may be. And these seem not to be very effective, indeed. The tonkwas I am talking about are that:
http://www.google.fr/imgres?imgurl=h...ed=0CCQQrQMwAA

Mine weighs 1 pound (a piece) and are just training tonkwas. If the craftsman who made them (a black belt kobudoka) had to make true weapons, he would use an even harder wood.

Originally Posted by DanHoward

The whole point of the Police tonfa/baton is that it isn't very effective at killing people. Police carry them because they are less lethal than their sidearm. These days the taser meets that criteria.

Which sounds to mean than the GURPS tonfa's stats are those for the police soft version...

Just note (but I'm sure you already know it) that in Okinawa, the police weapon was the sai, not the tonfa.

Originally Posted by Kale

I always thought the only useful part of it was letting somebody with a high unarmed combat skill use an unarmed parry effectively against a weapon. If you have Karate at 20, grab a tonfa if you plan on going against anybody with weapons. Otherwise take Shortsword at 21 and go to town with a long knife or better. The only other nice thing about it is it can easily be hidden under very loose sleeves typical of some places and times, in a ready-to-use position. Trying to pull a sword out of your sleeve will take a bit longer whereas with the tonfa you can still punch with it. If you parry while it is hidden under the sleeves it can help your character develop an 'iron arm' reputation as well.
I basically file it under 'cool martial arts weapon for usually unarmed characters' and leave it at that.

As a third dan karateka, I can assure that if someone never learned to use tonfa, he'd better never take it as a weapon. It's quickness to turn around once arm with a little wrist impulse make it a very dangerous weapon for the untrained user!

In kobudo, it is taught after bo (quarterstaff) and sai because it is harder to learn.

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

Seems to me like the Quarterstaff is likely to be king in that context...

The bo is a very good weapon, indeed. Its ability to keep foes at bay and to parry very quickly are good – and very well simulated in GURPS rules.

But it is a pity that GURPS tonkwa has not such a treatment in GURPS rules. As I said previously, it strikes much faster than any other kobudo weapon... It's ability to kill with one blow to the skull or to destroy knees are not really handled, because it doesn't do enough damage. One of my karate and kobudo sensei is a tonkwa specialist. She has something like ST 10, ST 11 at best. So, in GURPS terms, she is only supposed to deal 1d+1 cr with a swinging tonkwa blow. Hard to kill an average guy with that. Even hard to knock him out...

Originally Posted by DanHoward

If there were realistic options to make the tonfa better then we would already see them in real life. As soon as you put a parrying/disarming prong on a tonfa, you lose half of the other techniques it can be used with.

The quickness and the strength of tonkwa's blows is not taken into account. Tonkwa is considered by kobudokas as a much dangerous weapon than a nunchaku. And giving tonkwas the same damage than a light club is not at all realistic.

Furthermore, allowing a karateka to use a tonkwa to punch and parry freely is neither realistic, as I said above. Maintaining the tonkwa firmly on the arm requires a lot of training. And the hikite is very different. A karateka not specifically trained to use tonkwas would inevitably hurt himself. Despite 2 years of kobudo training (and 16 years of karate training), I wouldn't use it in a true combat. I'm not trained enough. I would rather use the bo, which is less dangerous but inflicts (in reality, not in GURPS) less damage.