[Low-Tech] Boating vs Shiphandling

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by whswhs

True for me, too. I take "boat" to mean all sorts of small craft, not just craft that one person can handle.

The brig in LT is debatable; at best it's at the upper end of anything that could be handled with Boating, and there's a fair case that it ought to require Shiphandling and Seamanship. There does seem to be a plausible zone of overlap, where big boats may sometimes be bigger than the smallest ships. It's a matter not of absolute size but of the organization of work.

Bill Stoddard

But the question remains, what trait of the organization is it that governs which skill is used? What leads a 30' single-masted fore-and aft-rigged Badan (LTC 3 p.41) to use Shiphandling, while a 21' single-masted fore-and aft-rigged sloop and a 50' two masted square-rigged Brig both use Boating (Low-Tech, p. 142)? When assigning skills to vessels not mentioned in the books, how does one determine which skill is relevant?

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by Dalillama

When assigning skills to vessels not mentioned in the books, how does one determine which skill is relevant?

It's very often the case when it is not clear which skill applies to a particular task that the correct answer is either one. I'd usually divide it that if the captain helps with the steering or sail handling, he's using Boating, if he stands aside and gives orders, it's Shiphandling, and if he changes from one to the other in the middle of the day, he could change the skill he rolls against to do exactly the same thing with exactly the same ship and crew.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by malloyd

It's very often the case when it is not clear which skill applies to a particular task that the correct answer is either one. I'd usually divide it that if the captain helps with the steering or sail handling, he's using Boating, if he stands aside and gives orders, it's Shiphandling, and if he changes from one to the other in the middle of the day, he could change the skill he rolls against to do exactly the same thing with exactly the same ship and crew.

And do the crew then switch off between using Boating and using Crewman, or how would you figure that?

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Dalillama

And do the crew then switch off between using Boating and using Crewman, or how would you figure that?

That sounds plausible to me, at least at a first look.

Bill Stoddard

[Dalillama]

I suppose that works. The reason I happened to notice is that I've got a character who owns a ship, and I'm trying to work out what skills to use, but in the end it's up to the GM, I suppose.

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by gruundehn

Never paid that much attention to rowing crews, does the cox of a rowing 8 steer or is that race just straight line?

They steer, keep time for the rowing and make the tactical decisions, such as "look for a part of the river where the current is more favourable, at the risk of a slightly longer route?"

It's a highly skilled job, it just doesn't involve much physical effort, unlike everyone else in the boat.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by johndallman

They steer, keep time for the rowing and make the tactical decisions, such as "look for a part of the river where the current is more favourable, at the risk of a slightly longer route?"

It's a highly skilled job, it just doesn't involve much physical effort, unlike everyone else in the boat.

Possibly the Coxswain uses Boating and the rowers use Oarsman?

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Dalillama

Possibly the Coxswain uses Boating and the rowers use Oarsman?

At that point, what are we gaining by the Coxswain not using a form of Shiphandling?

[Phil Masters]

Originally Posted by gruundehn

Never paid that much attention to rowing crews, does the cox of a rowing 8 steer or is that race just straight line?

Yes, last I looked the cox was operating a rudder. Even straight-line races require sticking to that line.

To be honest, I'd probably go for the Sports (Rowing Cox) option in that case. It's a highly specialised sort of boating. But it's certainly not Handling a Ship.

[Phil Masters]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

At that point, what are we gaining by the Coxswain not using a form of Shiphandling?

Like I said, aesthetics. The vessel in question is basically a highly refined TL8 plank of wood, with seating. It is not by any sane stretch of semantics a "ship".