[LT] No-steel-pocalypse! Lifespan of iron & steel equipment?

[Seneschal]

So, I'm currently GM-ing a low-fantasy-bordering-on-horror campaign inspired by Dark Souls. A thousand years ago, the main culture of the setting were the recipients of a divine boon that made them amazing blacksmiths (i.e. in their hands, iron had the melting point of lead), so they easily made steel weapons and late TL4 plate, even if their furnaces are TL1, 2 at most.

That boon is due to end in a month, and I was wondering just what kind of chaos would ensue. Assume that the biggest portion of their economy is based on metalworking. How soon would steel need maintenance which could not be done anymore? What components of infrastructure used iron or steel at TL4, and would now become irreplaceable? What adjustments would need to occur if an entire culture would have to switch to softer metals overnight?

[Turhan's Bey Company]

Originally Posted by Seneschal

How soon would steel need maintenance which could not be done anymore?

Metal items generally require much lower heat for maintenance (pounding out dents and the like). Anything which reaches melting temperatures...well, tends to melt the piece, which pretty much means you're starting over again. Most maintenance is simply stuff like sharpening, cleaning, and oiling, which generally don't need heating at all.

Originally Posted by Seneschal

What components of infrastructure used iron or steel at TL4, and would now become irreplaceable?

Iron/steel structural members are minimal at TL4. Depending on which flavor of TL4 you're using, there might be big chains used in suspension bridges (not used in Europe, but were used in China) and maybe to reenforce some kinds of structural members in elaborately vaulted buildings. Existing ones can probably be maintained reasonably well, but new architecture won't be able to freely incorporate such items.

Originally Posted by Seneschal

What adjustments would need to occur if an entire culture would have to switch to softer metals overnight?

Assuming Earth-like conditions, the supply of new metals plummets overnight, and you're stuck with copper alloys and lead. The problem isn't with hardness (good bronze is about as hard as reasonable-quality iron; indeed, early iron was worse than bronze), but with supply. There's much, much less copper than iron. With the barest trickle of new production, metal prices increase sharply, and it just gets worse as existing iron items slowly break and otherwise wear out from use. I wouldn't care to guess how fast that'll happen, though.

[ADAXL]

Originally Posted by Turhan's Bey Company

Iron/steel structural members are minimal at TL4. Depending on which flavor of TL4 you're using, there might be big chains used in suspension bridges (not used in Europe, but were used in China) and maybe to reenforce some kinds of structural members in elaborately vaulted buildings. Existing ones can probably be maintained reasonably well, but new architecture won't be able to freely incorporate such items.

I basically agree with Turhan's Bey Company, but there is the problem of maintenance. Many TL4 structures need constant repair, and that requires metal tools.

PS: That "ending of the boon", how does it work? Do people know in advance? Can they prepare by developing other technologies? If the main culture received to boon, what about the others? Can the people simply hire some engineers from another culture and shift to bronze?

How will people cope with the end of the boon mentally and culturally? Will people simply shrug and continue with work with other technology or will there be religious war, mass panic and hysteria?

[Nereidalbel]

Just one question: has any sort of alchemist (magical or historical) discovered aluminum? If yes, they may just be able to create the purest iron possible.

If not, corrosion is dependent on environmental factors, meaning those living in deserts will have steel much longer than those near the sea.

[WingedKagouti]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

If not, corrosion is dependent on environmental factors, meaning those living in deserts will have steel much longer than those near the sea.

Which could have a noticable impact on ships and long distance sailing. If ship construction is similar to real world TL3-4, there should be a decent amount of nails being used to hold them together. This would make sea travel more expensive and dangerous, do you really want to risk a week or two on a ship that may not have been properly maintained? Or do you go with an unproven concept that may fall apart in a strong breeze? Or can you reach your destination by land, even if that would take longer than by ship?

At least until some non-iron/steel using way of building long distance cargo holding ships has been discovered. But until then, most trade and travel will probably be across land with shorter trips to cross unavoidable water.

Any civilization that relies heavily on sailing could easily fall apart entirely.

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by WingedKagouti

If ship construction is similar to real world TL3-4, there should be a decent amount of nails being used to hold them together.

At Earth TL 3-4, it was common to use copper nails or wooden pegs ("treenails") simply because iron or steel nails corrode so fast in seawater. I haven't seen anything in this thread to indicate that the culture has stainless steel or other means of comprehensively protecting steel from corrosion.

[Nereidalbel]

Originally Posted by WingedKagouti

Which could have a noticable impact on ships and long distance sailing. If ship construction is similar to real world TL3-4, there should be a decent amount of nails being used to hold them together. This would make sea travel more expensive and dangerous, do you really want to risk a week or two on a ship that may not have been properly maintained? Or do you go with an unproven concept that may fall apart in a strong breeze? Or can you reach your destination by land, even if that would take longer than by ship?

At least until some non-iron/steel using way of building long distance cargo holding ships has been discovered. But until then, most trade and travel will probably be across land with shorter trips to cross unavoidable water.

Any civilization that relies heavily on sailing could easily fall apart entirely.

Eh, there's decent evidence of trans-Atlantic travel well before steel became a thing. Non-iron nails can do their job with a decent amount of corrosion, but, iron swords and armor will become useless in short order.

[PseudoFenton]

So in the last thousand years, noone has developed better furnaces? Despite knowing what hotter temperatures could do when working iron? Especially when there are seemingly rival cultures who didn't receive such a boon?

It seems likely that the power exchange simply moves to the few who have bothered to find alternative methods for iron/steel working (remember, that they would've have the benefit of steel tools and goods to this this, and a good knowledge of the medium, which makes things a lot easier). Or that alternatives are very quickly financed in an attempt to recapture what has been lost.

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by Seneschal

That boon is due to end in a month, and I was wondering just what kind of chaos would ensue. Assume that the biggest portion of their economy is based on metalworking. How soon would steel need maintenance which could not be done anymore? What components of infrastructure used iron or steel at TL4, and would now become irreplaceable? What adjustments would need to occur if an entire culture would have to switch to softer metals overnight?

Properly cared for steel tools that don't see a lot of use can last a century - half of my hand tools belonged to my father and are 50 or 60 years old - so the crisis isn't immediate.

Heavily used stuff will wear out faster, but most craftsmen who are well equipped now will still have usable gear in a decade or more. Your economy isn't going to crash overnight, or even this year, though the long term outlook is pretty poor. Nobody *new* can enter a profession that requires steel tools - your economy can't expand and is going to start contracting with a half life of decades in those industries, which is most of them.

The first really major crisis is probably plows - TL4 food surpluses are not large, so every farmer whose efficiency drops because his plow breaks mean somebody somewhere starves, and plowshares are worked pretty hard. Next year is probably OK, particularly if the planting season is already over, but if you don't solve this one pretty fast the year after that will be a hard year and half your population is going to be dead in a decade.

In some ways you are in luck though, because other TL4 industries, most significantly glassmaking, require high temperatures too, so you don't have to invent everything *completely* from scratch. Depending on how this boon worked you may need to invent a lot though. Real ironworking before about mid TL5 actually involved relatively little melting - because cast iron is frankly a fairly lousy material. If this boon got around that, and one assumes it did or it wasn't really all that valuable, these guys may have no ironworking techniques at all. Even if not prices are going to go up (if for no other reason than you need more fuel), but if you are lucky your civilization may just be looking at half century long depression rather than total doom.

[DanHoward]

As has been said, most iron and steel products will last for centuries if they are well maintained. Those that wear out can be replaced with bronze with no trouble so long as copper and tin are available. There were very few TL4 items that could only be made from steel. The only short term effect on society would be an increase in the cost of iron/steel items - depending on how much material is in the production pipelines. People would very quickly learn to look after what they have - recycling and repurposing would be even more prolific. As usual with situations like this, those who will be most affected will be the poorest members of society while the rich will barely notice.

There will be almost no long term effect. Bronze can be used as a short term replacement and TL1 furnaces have no trouble making iron and steel - it just takes longer and is less efficient. It won't take long at all to develop TL4 furnaces if the rest of society is TL4.