Penetrating Vision Limitation

[Kazander]

What would be a fair value for PV that only allows targeting through a solid substance, rather than actual "vision"?

The character has to know the target is present, so no firing through a castle wall 'guessing' a target 'might' be present. He has to know the target is in the room, and has a 'sixth sense' of the target's location without actually seeing the contents of the room (i.e. actually having sight). Essentially getting around the 'firing blind' problem.

Separately it would require Concentration to activate, and I think Requires Fatigue too.

This is DF, and the character in question is a very strong Centaur Archer with access to Imbuements. In this case, he'd be using Penetrating Strike at /10 or /100 to have the arrow go through the wall, but he needs a way of targeting. Being quite large, he is often left outside in towns and unable to assist his companions, and I thought this may be a way to get around it.

I guess it would also allow him to fire through Cover, since that's basically the same thing.

Thoughts and feedback appreciated. Thanks.

[Nereidalbel]

Can this archer "see" at least the outlines/silhouettes of people on the other side of walls? If so, this is basically wall-penetrating radar, giving you only minimal detail. Probably ok to give this a -40% on Penetrating Vision, since it doesn't really tell you friend from foe.

[Kazander]

I'm not envisioning that he can see outlines, but the effect may be equivalent. More of a "use the Force, Luke". No limits on targeting specific locations. I think basic IFF (friend/foe ID) would be part of it.

But he would not be able to 'see' what's going on in the room, read lips of the people in it, see that there's a valuable painting on the wall, etc.

He would need to know that there is a valid target in the room somehow: he was seen entering the dwelling, a 3rd person shouting "he's in the Den!", etc. He couldn't just walk down a street scanning for "bad guys".

[Nereidalbel]

Possibly a Detect ability, then. Successful roll allows for targeting a foe, failure is just a wasted Concentrate, and critical failure identifies a friend as a foe instead. GM should probably roll this one.

[The Benj]

Maybe Scanning Sense might do the trick? The fancy one penetrates cover and not only let's you target, but gives you a ranging bonus to aimed shots, but only works in a forward arc.

[Anthony]

Arguably Blind Fighting + Zen Archery (see B180) would do the job. How is he determining that an enemy is present to be shot?

[night-hunter]

Be really careful with this. I played a character with the "Rigellian sense of perception" at one point in a D&D campaign. Unless the player and GM have a complete understanding of what is and is not allowed this can get to be a major game unbalance. An alternative is to allow him to see through another's eyes via Magic or Telepathy in order to target.

[Kazander]

Originally Posted by The Benj

Maybe Scanning Sense might do the trick? The fancy one penetrates cover and not only let's you target, but gives you a ranging bonus to aimed shots, but only works in a forward arc.

Hmmm. Yes, I seem to have forgotten about Scanning Sense. With Penetrating and Targeting enhancements on Para-Radar, it seems very close to what I'm looking for. However, I would say it's actually more than what I'm looking for--it lets him see in the dark, too. It's also much more expensive than I had hoped, with a base cost of 68 points. I'll have to give it some thought.

[Kazander]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Arguably Blind Fighting + Zen Archery (see B180) would do the job. How is he determining that an enemy is present to be shot?

Blind Fighting still requires that you have some sense that can detect the target though, usually hearing. This is not intended to work through walls.

[Kazander]

Originally Posted by night-hunter

Be really careful with this. I played a character with the "Rigellian sense of perception" at one point in a D&D campaign. Unless the player and GM have a complete understanding of what is and is not allowed this can get to be a major game unbalance. An alternative is to allow him to see through another's eyes via Magic or Telepathy in order to target.

Yeah, I can see it being abusive. That's why I was trying to limit it. Not sure if it's enough limitation though. Not sure how the mechanics of allowing him to target a physical missile through someone else's eyes would work.