[RPM] Ritual Path Magic: doing the WEIRD stuff

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Humabout

Here's my stab at these. Thanks for two things: The challenge and the page number references.

This would largely depend on just what the in-game effect is. As per MH1, just getting information (regardless of how the process is described) is a Greater Sense Chance effect. You may need to add additional effects to represent any other effects (I watch how I am likely to die next and gain +1 to all active defenses to avoid it).

The game effect is probably described as the character becoming Time-Spanning. As in, the ability to think of time segments the way we think of the surrounding space.

Originally Posted by Humabout

I would approach this as a Greater Control Matter effect. It should probably include Altered Traits, DR (Force Field, +20%; Limited, Ranged Projectiles, -40%) sufficient to stop the damage you are trying to prevent.

I was looking at turning missiles, not blocking them. (If I were willing to emulate DR, I'd pick DR, but it's not what I meant.)

Originally Posted by Humabout

Greater Control Crossroads + Altered Traits, Jumper (Time Stop) + Area Effect?

Hmmm. Thanks.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Greater Create Mind + Greater Create Body + Duplication + Mindlink (Dupes)

Duplication doesn't seem to do the deal, since there's no duplication involved. Wounding, healing, tiring, feeding, or otherwise affecting one manifestation does not allow the other to be unaffected. On the contrary, the manifestations are also restricted in their movements (e.g. if moving forward hits a wall in the bedroom, you can't walk forward even though there's an empty space in front of you in the office.)

Originally Posted by Humabout

Greater Sense Chance with Bestows a Bonus (to Propaganda). To make a meme that will catch on, I'd use Greater Strengthen Chance.

Hmm, seems like a skill improvement from default, basically. Not as fancy-sounding, but seems to work.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Greater Sense Chance.

Hmm. Destinies, yes. Didn't think of it.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Lesser/Greater Create Crossroads (depending on destination; see T:RPM p. 9) + Greater Transform Body.

Hmm. If it requires Transform Body, then it will also require Transform Spirit/Mind/Matter/Energy/etc. to act the same way on the other entities that move through.

Originally Posted by Humabout

This depends on the ability. I would use an appropriate effect to bestow Altered Traits worth however many uses of that effect you want recharged. This could be a restore or strengthen effect, probably. Frex, Lesser Restore Chance + Altered Traits, Serendipity 1 or Lesser Restore Chance + Altered Traits, Extraordinary Luck.

So basically [5] per level of Destiny? It seems that just temporarily awarding 'character points' with the unspoken assumption that, being Chance-bestowed ones, they can only be used for Impulse Buys.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Greater Transform Mind + Altered Traits, Astral Entity.

Sorry, perhaps I used a confusing wording. I meant a permanent change, like becoming a Hungry Ghost upon dying, but instead making sure the transformation would be into a Being of Pure Thought (like in the old Psionics).

Originally Posted by Humabout

Sounds like creating a gate to a past time/destination. Lesser/Greater Create Crossroads.

I suppose you could look at it that way, but the important thing is that e.g. wounds sustained during the nasty events shouldn't move to the past, nor should earned money etc. And there shouldn't be two yous in the point to which the Rewind is performed.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Just about every iteration of this is naaaasty. PK (I think) actually posted rituals for this a long time ago during the dark days before Kromm found his bottle of Publishing Draino. IIRC, the ugly, ugly version was simply a Greater Restore Body + Greater Create Mind + Altered Traits, Extra Life (Cosmic, Retroactive) for a lot of points. It also wears off at the end of the spell's duration and the PC dies again. The PC is also resurrected The Monkey's Paw-style, mortal wounds and all.

The slightly less ugly version using Greater Transform Body + Greater Create Mind + Altered Traits, Unkillable (Cosmic, Retroactive) + Regeneration for a ton of points. This one also expires, but the person doesn't come back all bloody mess, at least.

I don't remember if there was a third, more permanent one, but then again, I'm not 100% the above are correct. The spirit is there, however.

I was thinking something less ugly and more permanent, closer to the one on M94. (Also, Create Mind kinda defeats the point, as the intent was to bring back someone; making a new one is a whole different affair - if you can make a copy instead of fixing what's on your hands, that has other, bigger consequences.)

[Humabout]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

The game effect is probably described as the character becoming Time-Spanning. As in, the ability to think of time segments the way we think of the surrounding space.

I'm not sure what sort of mechanical impacts that would have. From that point of view, maybe a Strengthen Mind effect. Lesser/Greater should probably result from the mechanical effects of such a boon.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

I was looking at turning missiles, not blocking them. (If I were willing to emulate DR, I'd pick DR, but it's not what I meant.)

I know you are reflecting missiles. But in doing so, the subject is not taking any damage. I don't see why altering a missile's KE sufficiently turn it back on its shooter costs less energy than stopping the missile. Hence the DR. Of course, RPM is all about the GM doing things the way (s)he sees fit within the setting. This is just how I see it. Maybe Ghostdancer or PK have a different take on this one.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Hmmm. Thanks.

You're welcome!

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Duplication doesn't seem to do the deal, since there's no duplication involved. Wounding, healing, tiring, feeding, or otherwise affecting one manifestation does not allow the other to be unaffected. On the contrary, the manifestations are also restricted in their movements (e.g. if moving forward hits a wall in the bedroom, you can't walk forward even though there's an empty space in front of you in the office.)

Ah, I thought you meant you had copies running around doing different things elsewhere. So this is more of a Clairsentience with a Cannot Move limitations? I'd build it as such. Greater Strengthen Mind + Altered Traits, Clairsentience (suitable enhancements and limitations).

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Hmm, seems like a skill improvement from default, basically. Not as fancy-sounding, but seems to work.

I'm aiming at the mechanics for a lot of these. Divinations are specifically Path of Chance effects, so that's where I'm getting these. Otherwise, you might be able to do some sort of massive Sense Mind effect to get the same bonus, but you'd have to affect an AoE big enough to include your entire audience.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Hmm. Destinies, yes. Didn't think of it.

Again, you said, "Divine" and I thought "Sense Chance." There are probably other ways to go about it, but this is the one specifically called out in MH1.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Hmm. If it requires Transform Body, then it will also require Transform Spirit/Mind/Matter/Energy/etc. to act the same way on the other entities that move through.

I didn't think of objects or spirits. Minds are nonmaterial, so they wouldn't get smaller or mirored, and energy shouldn't matter, either (which side is the "left" side of a laser beam doesn't really change the effect of the laser). I suppose you could drop the Transform Body if you just declare that gates can do that sort of thing. Again, this is a GM call.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

So basically [5] per level of Destiny? It seems that just temporarily awarding 'character points' with the unspoken assumption that, being Chance-bestowed ones, they can only be used for Impulse Buys.

That was my thinking. Don't forget that rolling quirks when bestowing destiny can get kind of hairy for the caster.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Sorry, perhaps I used a confusing wording. I meant a permanent change, like becoming a Hungry Ghost upon dying, but instead making sure the transformation would be into a Being of Pure Thought (like in the old Psionics).

I'm not familiar with old Psionics, but that's what I thought you meant. Essentially, the person is not dying. He's gaining a new racial template. I'd use Altered Traits to apply that template when he dies. You might require that it be cast as a conditional ritual, but being a Greater Transformation effect, I'd let it be instant and the effects permanent.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

I suppose you could look at it that way, but the important thing is that e.g. wounds sustained during the nasty events shouldn't move to the past, nor should earned money etc. And there shouldn't be two yous in the point to which the Rewind is performed.

Then include a sufficient Restore Body effect to heal any injuries you had when you left the present. The rest sounds like a special effect. It's still a gate effect that traverses time rather that space.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

I was thinking something less ugly and more permanent, closer to the one on M94. (Also, Create Mind kinda defeats the point, as the intent was to bring back someone; making a new one is a whole different affair - if you can make a copy instead of fixing what's on your hands, that has other, bigger consequences.)

Let me see if I can find the original post. Now that you mention it, I think it might have been Control Spirit and not Create Mind (which I think was for creating intelligent undead or something). Also, The Old Ways from Pyrammid #56 has a very forgiving take on resurrection called Revivify. That might be up your alley.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Humabout

I'm not sure what sort of mechanical impacts that would have. From that point of view, maybe a Strengthen Mind effect. Lesser/Greater should probably result from the mechanical effects of such a boon.

Well, example effects would be knowing (during all points on the segment and thereafter) all events observed on any point of the segment. Which means that if you perform an action that changes the 'default flow', you immediately know the consequences up to the endpoint of the segment. Note that you can't know about events which you don't observe on the segment, e.g. events after your own death (but you do know that you die at point x, and if you have enough time to change the events from the default flow, you can act accordingly based on this knowledge). I think it was Dr. Manhattan in Watchers who exhibited the most popular example of this phenomenon.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Ah, I thought you meant you had copies running around doing different things elsewhere. So this is more of a Clairsentience with a Cannot Move limitations? I'd build it as such. Greater Strengthen Mind + Altered Traits, Clairsentience (suitable enhancements and limitations).

It's not clairsentience either. It's being in two places simultaneously. Remember the occasionally-discussed idea of living both in the real and the spirit world simultaneously in GURPS Shadowrun conversions? Maybe also some WoD conversions too. Basically, the character is affected by the two (or more) different locations.

Originally Posted by Humabout

I didn't think of objects or spirits. Minds are nonmaterial, so they wouldn't get smaller or mirored, and energy shouldn't matter, either (which side is the "left" side of a laser beam doesn't really change the effect of the laser). I suppose you could drop the Transform Body if you just declare that gates can do that sort of thing. Again, this is a GM call.

Minds are nonmaterial, but they're asymmetric too: damaging the left half of the brain will bring down the left half of the mind with it, right will damage the right, and the effects are not the same. Not reflecting the mind while inverting the body will result in funny effects like flipping the scars on the body, but not flipping handedness of the mind. Energy does matter: a laser projecting a hologram through the gate will or will not be mirrored depending on the choice; not mirroring the kinetic energy of e.g. moving blood will also probably have a negative effect, as the energy gets dumped into other organs.

Originally Posted by Humabout

That was my thinking. Don't forget that rolling quirks when bestowing destiny can get kind of hairy for the caster.

Oh, yes, Quirks are Quirky. But the idea of granting 'Impulse Points' directly instead of recharging a pool like one recharges HP and FP pools still seems lucrative, mostly because it also works on characters without MH Destiny.

Originally Posted by Humabout

I'm not familiar with old Psionics, but that's what I thought you meant. Essentially, the person is not dying. He's gaining a new racial template. I'd use Altered Traits to apply that template when he dies. You might require that it be cast as a conditional ritual, but being a Greater Transformation effect, I'd let it be instant and the effects permanent.

Oh, I see the Enchantment solution. Will check it out.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Then include a sufficient Restore Body effect to heal any injuries you had when you left the present. The rest sounds like a special effect. It's still a gate effect that traverses time rather that space.

Hmm. So also Restore Matter and the like. Unexpected.

Originally Posted by Humabout

Let me see if I can find the original post. Now that you mention it, I think it might have been Control Spirit and not Create Mind (which I think was for creating intelligent undead or something). Also, The Old Ways from Pyrammid #56 has a very forgiving take on resurrection called Revivify. That might be up your alley.

Oh, found it. Thanks. Hmm, so it seems that I need to award Unkillable 2 and Regeneration in a similar manner if I want to do it without loss of points.

[Humabout]

Check out Ghostdancer's response, too, Vicky. He's got a different take on those than I do, and he's probably closer to the mark (I usually defer to him unless it really goes against the grain of the setting).

Oh, yes, Quirks are Quirky. But the idea of granting 'Impulse Points' directly instead of recharging a pool like one recharges HP and FP pools still seems lucrative, mostly because it also works on characters without MH Destiny.

If your game doesn't use MH Destiny or Impulse Buys, then this spell doesn't exist. I would generally offer it up as a way to recharge your use of an existing ability (although a similar ritual could just grant an instant use of that ability).

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Humabout

Check out Ghostdancer's response, too, Vicky. He's got a different take on those than I do, and he's probably closer to the mark (I usually defer to him unless it really goes against the grain of the setting).

I did, thanks.

More weird stuff:

Draw Power, RPM Style: As the one on p. 180 of GURPS Magic, but instead getting a stream of GURPS Magic energy, get a stream of RPM energy.

Essential Fuel. Same as the one on M180.

Scare the tech spirit / 'Gremlins': based on the Gremlins Gift of Ragabash Werewolves had in oWoD: Disrupt or scare away the spirit of a technological item, making it stop working. Computers don't compute, guns don't shoot, phones don't call, knives don't cut, ropes don't bind, levers don't multiply force, writing doesn't convey meaning.

Thieving Talons of the Magpie (ditto WW): steal a supernatural ability / skill from another and temporarily use it for oneself.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Draw Power, RPM Style: As the one on p. 180 of GURPS Magic, but instead getting a stream of GURPS Magic energy, get a stream of RPM energy.

I wouldn't. That spell is wonky enough to begin with. But if you must, I'd do what Dwarf99 suggested in the other thread: use subject weight and read lbs. as kW, then find the number of energy it would cost to do that and reverse it. So a device whose output was 30 megawatts would give +1 energy per second. Your HT-based Path of Energy skill or Magery+HT would cap how much energy you could draw. I have no idea if that's balanced, again, Draw Power is not exactly a forthcoming spell.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Essential Fuel. Same as the one on M180.

Essential spell effects aren't very RPM-like (so says PK from a emal a lonnnggg time ago). That said, the exact effects of this spell would be a Greater Transform Matter effect using Duration.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Scare the tech spirit / 'Gremlins': based on the Gremlins Gift of Ragabash Werewolves had in oWoD: Disrupt or scare away the spirit of a technological item, making it stop working. Computers don't compute, guns don't shoot, phones don't call, knives don't cut, ropes don't bind, levers don't multiply force, writing doesn't convey meaning.

Lesser Destroy Matter, Lesser Control Chance, or Lesser Control Spirit to Bestow a Bonus, Malfunction number -5 (32). Since most objects don't have a malfunction number, you'd start at 19 (no malfunction possible) and then penalize the roll. In this case, -5, so the device goes AWOL on a 14 or higher on the operation roll.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Thieving Talons of the Magpie (ditto WW): steal a supernatural ability / skill from another and temporarily use it for oneself.

Greater Transform Body + Greater Transform Body (or Undead, Spirit, etc.; whatever it takes to affect the target). Use altered traits to replicate the ability if it's more than a single use (i.e., it has a Duration).

[Humabout]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

Greater Destroy Matter or Lesser Control Spirit to Bestow a Bonus, Malfunction number -5 (32). Since most objects don't have a malfunction number, you'd start at 19 (no malfunction possible) and then penalize the roll. In this case, -5, so the device goes AWOL on a 14 or higher on the operation roll.

Why a Greater Destroy Matter? I was going with the thought that "if it can happen without magic, then it's a lesser effect," and I've known people that break everything mechanical or electronic they touch. And they aren't even wizards or in Chicago. I do like the lowering of the Malf. rating, though. I'm totally stealing that.

[Humabout]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

I did, thanks.

More weird stuff:

Cool, I'm without books atm, so this may be a bit off (especially to reference Magic for the spells mentioned).

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Draw Power, RPM Style: As the one on p. 180 of GURPS Magic, but instead getting a stream of GURPS Magic energy, get a stream of RPM energy.

I'm not sure about this spell. Getting free energy from a ritual for new rituals sounds too crockish. If its about turning energy from a generator or battery into RPM energy while putting a load on that device, it could be tricky. I'd probably use a Transform Energy effect and a Transform Magic effect. How much energy is gained from the ritual per watt drained is beyond me, though. That'd probably take some number running. Also, due to the potential energy-crock nature of such a ritual, I'd probably make these greater effects. I really shutter to think of what could happen if you got more energy out of a ritual than what went in . . .

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Essential Fuel. Same as the one on M180.

Without remembering the effects of the spell, I'd just say it's a Greater Transform Matter effect.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Scare the tech spirit / 'Gremlins': based on the Gremlins Gift of Ragabash Werewolves had in oWoD: Disrupt or scare away the spirit of a technological item, making it stop working. Computers don't compute, guns don't shoot, phones don't call, knives don't cut, ropes don't bind, levers don't multiply force, writing doesn't convey meaning.

Per fluff, I'd say this is a Control Spirit, but mechanically it's just a Lesser Destroy Matter effect would have the same effect. This is where you have to decide what fits your setting. Just remember that you'll need an Area Effect and if you go the Destroy Matter route, you'll need a Weight for the entire weight of all machines affected (a potentially substantial energy cost).

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Thieving Talons of the Magpie (ditto WW): steal a supernatural ability / skill from another and temporarily use it for oneself.

Destroy Body/Mind (depending on ability) + Create/Control/Transform Body/Mind (depending on ability) + Altered Traits/Bestows a Bonus (depending on ability/skill). Lesser/Greater depends on the ability; skills would probably be lesser effects, in general.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Humabout

Without remembering the effects of the spell, I'd just say it's a Greater Transform Matter effect.

Thinking some more, Altered Traits: Create (+50% Essential) is the strictly-RAW way to do it (Powers 94). But it seems extremely roundabout. So maybe +50% energy from the mass table? Or as if conjuring +50% more mass?

Originally Posted by Humabout

Per fluff, I'd say this is a Control Spirit, but mechanically it's just a Lesser Destroy Matter effect would have the same effect. This is where you have to decide what fits your setting. Just remember that you'll need an Area Effect and if you go the Destroy Matter route, you'll need a Weight for the entire weight of all machines affected (a potentially substantial energy cost).

Hmm. This gives me another idea:
An Energy- or Entropy-based spell that makes the laws of physics have a chance of not occurring on a macroscopic scale. Random stuff happening, like momentum failing to transfer in a collision, quantum phenomena inexplicably aligning in myriads of instances to allow a coin to fall through a solid object, chemicals failing to react on a first attempt (but reacting normally on a subsequent one), a calculation of П ending up producing 3.0 instead of 3.14 in this one iteration etc.