The Definite d20/D&D Conversion thread

[Anthony]

I don't think the sorcerer/wizard distinction makes sense when using GURPS Magic. The distinction is basically that wizards need grimoires, but can cast any spell in their grimoire, while sorcerers can't use grimoires.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert

I wouldn't, since "skinny" is one of those appearance-related charms that are based on the average for one's race - or at least, that's how I've always read it.

Skinny gives -2 ST vs knockback, -2 to Disguise, -2 to Shadowing and prohibits HT above 14.

[Jürgen Hubert]

Originally Posted by Anthony

I don't think the sorcerer/wizard distinction makes sense when using GURPS Magic. The distinction is basically that wizards need grimoires, but can cast any spell in their grimoire, while sorcerers can't use grimoires.

Which is why my approach would be to allow both learn and use standard GURPS Magic. "Sorcerers" are those with Wild Talent (magic) with Retention and the "Shortcut to Power" perk. "Wizards" are those who use Super-Memorization to temporary "learn" spells they don't know innately. A mage can be either a sorcerer or wizard, both, or neither. And "multiclassing" between the two is a lot less awkward than in D&D.

[Faolyn]

The problem, I think, is that in D&D, sorcerers have a smaller number of spells but don't have to memorize, and cast them more often than wizards can--it's not that they have limitations on the magic they do have, but are actually just more flexible with what they do have. That's the reason I went for limited colleges but gave them Wildcard abilities.

If you don't want to do that (yeah, I can see why not) perhaps allow them enhancements or limitations on Magery or individual spells, or give them Imbuments or Powers-as-magic, or Modular Abilities with a small number of spell slots (maybe not exceeding Magery, or (Will + Magery)/2), but allow them to pick any spell they want and not have to worry about prereqs.

[Jürgen Hubert]

Once more, with feeling.


Dwarves (52 points)

Spoiler:  

Size Modifier: -1
Attribute Modifiers: HT +1 [10].
Secondary Characteristic Modifiers: Basic Move -1 [-5]
Advantages: Dark Vision [25]; Extended Lifespan 2 [4], Resistant (Magic, +3 to resistance rolls) [10], Resistant (Poison, +3 to HT) [5].
Perks: Can intuitively know the depth underground [1], Huge Weapons (SM) [1], Resistant To Knockback 2 (+2 to ST for knockback purposes only) [2]
Features: Upper body and feet armor and clothing fit SM 0 humanoids and vice versa.

Elves (47 points)

Spoiler:  

Attribute Modifiers: DX +1 [20], HT -1 [-10].
Secondary Characteristic Modifiers: Per +2 [10], HP -1 [-2]
Advantages: Extended Lifespan 3 [6], Less Sleep 4 [8], Magery 0 [5], Night Vision 3 [3], Resistant (Immunity to supernatural “sleep” effects) [5], Resistant (+3 versus supernatural charm effects)
Perks: Trance instead of sleep

Gnomes (15 points)

Spoiler:  

Size Modifier: -2
Attribute Modifiers: ST -1 [-10], HT +1 [10].
Secondary Characteristic Modifiers: Basic Move -1 [-5]
Advantages: Acute Hearing +2 [4], Extended Lifespan 2 [4], Magery 0 [5], Night Vision 3 [3], Resistant (Illusions, +3) [5].
Innate Spells: Beast Soother [1], Simple Illusion [1].
Perks: Shortcut to Power (Beast-Soother).
Notes: Only gnomes with IQ 11+ can cast Simple Illusion.

Half-Elves (17 points)

Spoiler:  

Secondary Characteristic Modifiers: Per +1 [5]
Advantages: Extended Lifespan 1 [2], Night Vision 3 [3], Resistant (Immunity to supernatural “sleep” effects) [5], Resistant (+3 versus supernatural charm effects)[2].

Changelog:

Dwarves: Adjusted Extended Lifespan, Huge Weapons perk. Added feature representing their body proportions.
Elves: Adjusted Extended Lifespan, added Resistant to Charm Effects, HP -1 (to reflect the fact that elves are rather frail... maybe this should replace HT -1?)
Half-elves: Adjusted Extended Lifespan, Night Vision, added Resistant to Charm Effects
Gnomes: SM -2, Removed Speak With Animals, added Magery 0, Beast-Soother, Simple Illusion, Shortcut to Power perk.

Half-orcs and halflings did not require any further changes, and thus were put into the Repository.

[Faolyn]

Originally Posted by Faolyn

The problem, I think, is that in D&D, sorcerers have a smaller number of spells but don't have to memorize, and cast them more often than wizards can--it's not that they have limitations on the magic they do have, but are actually just more flexible with what they do have. That's the reason I went for limited colleges but gave them Wildcard abilities.

If you don't want to do that (yeah, I can see why not) perhaps allow them enhancements or limitations on Magery or individual spells, or give them Imbuments or Powers-as-magic, or Modular Abilities with a small number of spell slots (maybe not exceeding Magery, or (Will + Magery)/2), but allow them to pick any spell they want and not have to worry about prereqs.

Slightly more awake now.

Add the limitation that they can only change each slot once a day, so if they only have, say, 3 slots and decide to use them on Seeker, Sense Foes, and Summon Spirit, then they can't switch them out for Fireball, Fly, and Turn Zombie until the next day. But they can leave the slot open for as long as they want.

Hmmm. Perhaps 2 x Magery, for the max number of slots. Dunno about the cost, though.

[Laughing Man]

Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert

Changelog:

Elves: Adjusted Extended Lifespan, added Resistant to Charm Effects, HP -1 (to reflect the fact that elves are rather frail... maybe this should replace HT -1?)

HT -1 should definitely stay, in my opinion. The added HP -1 makes sense though, since Constitution in D&D means also having less HP. So it is fine by me, as it is.

[Laughing Man]

This reminds me a bit of the Dark Eye conversion I helped with in another forum. Everything went smooth, but we never got around to deciding on a magic system, because everybody had his own ideas and favourites :)

Me, for example, I was very with leaving things like spell slots behind me, when I left D&D. It is hard for me to even imagine that somebody would like to emulate them in GURPS again :D

That's probably what I love about GURPS though.

[Jürgen Hubert]

I reorganized a few wiki pages. Now there is a separate D&D Conversion page, and the D&D Monster Conversion page is now located here.

[Jürgen Hubert]

Originally Posted by Laughing Man

This reminds me a bit of the Dark Eye conversion I helped with in another forum. Everything went smooth, but we never got around to deciding on a magic system, because everybody had his own ideas and favourites :)

Well, we need not fall into the same trap. I've created a page for D&D Magic in GURPS, and I encourage everyone to submit their own variants there. We don't need to work out the "one true way" - instead we can come up with all sorts of variants so that each GM can pick their own favorites for their campaigns.

EDIT: The new templates and edit windows for D&D magic rules, spells, magical styles, martial arts, and races should work, but they are still untested - so if something is buggy, please tell me about it!