[DF] Imma Chargin' Mah (Fantasy) Lazors!!!

[Stripe]

For an upcoming Dungeon Fantasy session, I'm considering introducing ray guns in the style of He-Man and the Masters of the Universe or Taarna or Thundarr the Barbarian or Filmation's The New Adventures of Flash Gordon -- basically Conan the Barbarian plus ray guns. Normally, though I love the original Final Fantasy and Final Fantasy IV with all my heart, I don't like mixing sci-fi with my fantasy in table-top gaming, but this is just a short campaign of connected dungeons.

What I don't want to do is make the ray guns magic boom sticks like musket-shaped wands enchanted with Lightning Bolt. I want them to be fashioned with some form of weird fantasy technology, probably using crystals, mirrors (making them fragile), platinum and gold with wooden stocks. I want them to be TL3^ on the very cutting edge, almost TL4^.

I want to make sure they are balanced in a fantasy setting beside archers using bows and arrows.

As a starting reference point for balance, Heroic Archers with striking ST 13 and a composite bow does 1d+3 imp damage per turn, more for Weapon Masters. However, they can use different arrows including bodkin points doing piercing damage with an armor divisor (B277), or willow leaf arrows doing cutting damage (Treasure-Tables, p. 8; Low-Tech, p. 73). They add accuracy bonus without taking an Aim maneuver and have further options in Power-Ups that can make them even more fearsome. Plus, bows will be much cheaper. So, adding balanced ray guns won't make archers obsolete. At least, that's the goal.

While I was going to design my own, the more I thought about it, the more I like the idea of just using unmodified electro lasers. Then, I adjusted the damage up to 1d(2) burn (still with the surge and aff) and worsened the Shots considerably from practically unlimited to 12(3) and 24(3). Getting "ammo" will be as difficult as magic items.

Weapon           Damage       Acc  Range      Weight   RoF  Shots  Cost    ST   Bulk Rcl
Composite Bow    1d+3 imp     3    280/350    4/0.1    1    1(2)   $900    10†  -7   -
Handgonne, .90   2d pi++      0    100/600    15/0.1   1    1(60)  $300    10†  -6   4
Musket, .75      4d pi++      2    100/1,500  13/0.05  1    1(15)  $200    10†  -6   4

Raygonne         1d (2) burn  4    40/80      2.2/0.5  3    12(3)  $1,800  4    -2   1
linked           HT-4(2) aff  
Ray-Musket       1d (2) burn  8+1  160/470    3.7/1    3    24(3)  $3,900  4†   -4   1
linked           HT-4(2) aff

I threw a couple old guns in there for reference.

using the stats from the Basic Set, electro lasers don't have good range or damage, certainly not against armored opponents. In fact, they seem to be a pretty poorly suited for the battle field. They seem to perhaps have been designed for riot control or as less-lethal police sidearms.

As personal weapons in a fantasy campaign, though, they don't seem too terribly bad, especially for a dual-weapon fighter who has a sword or axe in one hand, raygonne in the other. With a rapier, it would be a cool Swashbuckler concept.

What do you all think? Would they be too powerful or too weak? Should I lower the damage back down to 1d-3 burn with no armor divisor?

What about unmodified TL9^ flamers from Ultra-Tech?

Of course, when they first encounter them, they won't have any idea how to use them, but they will know they are weapons from seeing them used previously. I'll have an NPC there to tell them, "This is the business end. Don't point it at anything you don't want to kill. Hold it like this. Look through the sites like this. Pull this trigger to make it shoot. Be careful with that. You'll shoot your eye out."

I'm considering introducing the concept in a dungeon-ized wreckage of an ancient alien spaceship. Most, if not all, of the psionic elder-thing space alien squizards are dead, but the psychopathic AI still functions as do a small squad of robot soldiers. Real robots, not robot-like golems, mind you. Of course, the robots will probably be colored evil-skull white and there will be a bad-ass black version and scary red version. The Mother Brain-like boss will be a giant psi-borg.

I think it would be a significant and refreshing departure from what I've done in the past.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Nifty. Let me also suggest checking out David Pulver's Blaster and Laser Design in #3/37 Pyramid: Tech and Toys (p. 11) and my own Metatronic Generators #3/46 Pyramid: Weird Science (p. 16) for designing further blaster-y weaponry.

[quarkstomper]

I'm kind of in a similar situation with the Thundercats campaign I just started. My wife's character got a hold of an enemy's rife. I decided to give it the Electro-carbine stats, as it was incapacitating but mostly non-lethal and I thought better fit the genre than something doing massive armor-piercing burn damage

[Faolyn]

Maybe the laser guns from Tales of the Solar Patrol, since they come with that space opera-y over-the-top feel built in?

[Stripe]

Thudercats! Another great example of the sci-fi fantasy genre, as is John Carter of Mars, of which I've read the first Barsoom book but not seen the movie.

So, there's one vote for going back to just using the unmodified EL stats.

I don't have Tales so I don't know about them.

[Stripe]

Okay, the more I think about it, unmodified electro lasers from Ultra-Tech look like the way to go. I like the idea of the kill/stun setting, too.

Apparently -- and correct me if I'm wrong with a page reference -- damage doesn't need to penetrate DR to cause the affliction and need to roll against stunning, though victims get half DR as a bonus to the HT roll. If so, that will make them good weapons against the Electrical robots, and actually any high-DR, high-HP creature capable of being stunned, such as dragons or giants or power-armor troops.

Yeah, they really seem to work well with the genre. They are altogether different than bows and thus don't really threaten that niche.

Thinking more about the game, I'm planing on having the PC's accidentally awaken the ship, which is a long-lost scout of a horrible alien civilization of cruel psionic Mindwarpers who feed upon the brains of the sentient. If the ship gets away, the whole world could be doomed!

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Stripe

For an upcoming Dungeon Fantasy session, I'm considering introducing ray guns in the style of He-Man and the Masters of the Universe or Taarna or Thundarr the Barbarian or Filmation's The New Adventures of Flash Gordon -- basically Conan the Barbarian plus ray guns. Normally, though I love the original Final Fantasy and Final Fantasy IV with all my heart, I don't like mixing sci-fi with my fantasy in table-top gaming, but this is just a short campaign of connected dungeons.

No Skeleton Warriors or Jayce and the Wheeled Warriors?

[Stripe]

Originally Posted by Jovus

How can I get in this game? (Kidding, but it would be cool.)

You're always welcome at my table, virtual or otherwise, Big J! :)

Originally Posted by Jovus

I'd imagine you don't want to go overboard with this, though.

Really, I don't. What I don't want this to turn into is a magical metropolis of arcanepunk. I still want to keep it subtle, but in some ways Magic makes magic too good to refuse. We all know the spells that can be abused like crazy. Why grow food when you can create it instantly and easily? Why worry about gold when you can wave your hand and conjure a pile of it? Flying Carpet makes a flying car that puts a horse to shame -- guided by thought at Move 15 perpetually; who wouldn't want that? Things like that. It'll be carefully balanced so that magic is still wondrous, not entirely commonplace. Close to an elfish city in Lord of the Rings, probably.

Originally Posted by Jovus

Places to look for direct inspiration might include GURPS Technomancer, though that's a higher TL than you intend, and GURPS Fantasy Tech 1 - The Edge of Reality (I don't think there are any more in that series, unfortunately.)

Hey, I actually have that last one! XD

Originally Posted by Jovus

Also, it needs be said that much of the magic in Jack Vance's Dying Earth books has the feel of actually being science. D&D magic wands have always (to me) had the feel of being ray-guns and the like, complete with limited charges and strange methods of activation.

You know, I've always wanted to read some Vance but I never got around to it. Maybe I'll start there. Thanks for the recommendation. :)

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

No Skeleton Warriors or Jayce and the Wheeled Warriors?

Ah, JatWW was right at the beginning of my cartoon watching days and Skeleton Warriors was right at the very end of my childhood. Loved 'em both.

Also, Jayce had some totally rad hair, didn't he? :D

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Stripe

Ah, JatWW was right at the beginning of my cartoon watching days and Skeleton Warriors was right at the very end of my childhood. Loved 'em both.

Also, Jayce had some totally rad hair, didn't he? :D

Oh yeah. Me too. That and Centurions (and all of the others you mentioned up thread) were some of my favorite cartoons. Are you going to post campaign notes somewhere? I'd be interested in following along.

[Stripe]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

Oh yeah. Me too. That and Centurions (and all of the others you mentioned up thread) were some of my favorite cartoons. Are you going to post campaign notes somewhere? I'd be interested in following along.

Centurions and Visionaries: Knights of the Magical Light were on some network we didn't pick up on the antenna way out in the sticks, along with some others of the time. I liked the toys, though. XD

But, dude, Silverhawks never gets enough love because it's the stepchild brother of Thundercats. Always in big bro's shadow. Amirite?

As for campaign notes, I've been keeping this very hush, but I have a very large DF blog project I've been hacking away at, but I want to get a lot of content before it goes live. No prediction on time. Believe me, everyone will know about it and no one will miss its opening, I promise.