Magic to RPM Complete Conversion

[Laughing Man]

I was reading another thread about RPM and ran across something which may be relevant for this thread. Here is a quote from this thread:

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

So even though Fireball that inflicts 3d burning damage is a Greater Create Energy effect normally (which would cost 18 energy) if it is a "everyman" spell in your setting it would become a Lesser Create Energy (for a mere 6 energy). This gives you the effect you are going for (making magic easier for specific spells) without artifically inflating CP costs.

When I compare that fireball to your conversion, there is a significant difference. You use Lesser Create Energy+Lesser Control Energy, whereas Ghostdancer proposed to only use Lesser Create Energy. This lead me to the question what Lesser Control Energy is for in your spell. Isn't it enjough to Create the energy and then just throw the fireball via Innate Attack or Throwing skill?

As I am writing this, I feel like I already know the answer: You can do it however you like. Either throw it via Lesser Control Energy or via the usual way of Innate Attack. I still would be interesting in your answer and why you chose to do it this way.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Laughing Man

Even though that answer isn't helpful, still thank you. It seems like I have a misunderstand of what RPM is and I don't want to further spam this thread for my problem.

Apologies. Let me see...Ritual Path Magic was created whole cloth BUT had many sources to draw on for inspiration. Realm Magic, Verb/Noun Magic, the Nobilis system for miracles, Mage the Ascension, Path/Book magic, etc. It is its own system but had a lot of help from other things. That said it's very easy to get confused with RPM because there are two other systems that use the word 'ritual' to describe their magic system (Ritual magic which uses standard magic as a basis and Path/Book magic which uses rituals). If you haven't read it, it starts on p. 32 of Monster Hunters 1. It's only eight pages long. I find I have to constantly refresh my knowledge of how things work. :-)

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

RPM is one particular interpretation of Path/Book Magic, with a lot of options tossed it. It's sort of a "worked example." One of the options they chose was to focus on energy accumulation, rather than effect shaping.

Sort of. I wouldn't say it's a interpretation of anything. It's more like gumbo. Toss the stuff you like in a pot, let it similar, and YUM.

All this talk of effect shaping using RPM is giving me a bit of idea though...Hmmmm. Might make a good article. :-)

[lexington]

Originally Posted by Laughing Man

I was reading another thread about RPM and ran across something which may be relevant for this thread. Here is a quote from this thread:


When I compare that fireball to your conversion, there is a significant difference. You use Lesser Create Energy+Lesser Control Energy, whereas Ghostdancer proposed to only use Lesser Create Energy. This lead me to the question what Lesser Control Energy is for in your spell. Isn't it enjough to Create the energy and then just throw the fireball via Innate Attack or Throwing skill?

As I am writing this, I feel like I already know the answer: You can do it however you like. Either throw it via Lesser Control Energy or via the usual way of Innate Attack. I still would be interesting in your answer and why you chose to do it this way.

Lesser Create Energy does just that, create energy, and nothing more. To make it into an "fireball" that you can throw it has to be brought under control, molded and shaped, not allowed to escape.

[vierasmarius]

I notice that many rituals have "Extra Energy" added in. What's the purpose of that? I'm guessing it's for any extra effects (Subject Weight, Range, Duration, etc) that may be needed, but aren't accounted for by default. If that's the case, does that mean spells from this grimoire can't cost more than their normal casting cost (ie, if you want to affect a much bigger target, you'll need to improvise)?

[Raekai]

Originally Posted by Laughing Man

I was reading another thread about RPM and ran across something which may be relevant for this thread. Here is a quote from this thread:


When I compare that fireball to your conversion, there is a significant difference. You use Lesser Create Energy+Lesser Control Energy, whereas Ghostdancer proposed to only use Lesser Create Energy. This lead me to the question what Lesser Control Energy is for in your spell. Isn't it enjough to Create the energy and then just throw the fireball via Innate Attack or Throwing skill?

As I am writing this, I feel like I already know the answer: You can do it however you like. Either throw it via Lesser Control Energy or via the usual way of Innate Attack. I still would be interesting in your answer and why you chose to do it this way.

Originally Posted by lexington

Lesser Create Energy does just that, create energy, and nothing more. To make it into an "fireball" that you can throw it has to be brought under control, molded and shaped, not allowed to escape.

That would essentially be it. I felt like a mere 6 energy would be too cheap, and I mention this in the original post. So I just added a nice control energy/matter to even out that cost a little bit.

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

I notice that many rituals have "Extra Energy" added in. What's the purpose of that? I'm guessing it's for any extra effects (Subject Weight, Range, Duration, etc) that may be needed, but aren't accounted for by default. If that's the case, does that mean spells from this grimoire can't cost more than their normal casting cost (ie, if you want to affect a much bigger target, you'll need to improvise)?

Extra energy is added on for the cost of the enhancements to damage. The double knockback or incendiary or whatever you find... It's 1 point per 5% and I just decided to show that by using the extra energy.

I'm glad I'm able to clear stuff up!

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Raekai

That would essentially be it. I felt like a mere 6 energy would be too cheap, and I mention this in the original post. So I just added a nice control energy/matter to even out that cost a little bit.

This really needs to be prefaced in the beginning of the thread because it's such a far deviation from how the rules actually work. That said I really don't have a problem being able to toss a 3d Fireball for 6 energy. In fact, in most DF-esque games this should be a FEATURE, not a bug.

Originally Posted by Raekai

Extra energy is added on for the cost of the enhancements to damage. The double knockback or incendiary or whatever you find... It's 1 point per 5% and I just decided to show that by using the extra energy.

I'm glad I'm able to clear stuff up!

Hmmm. I'd probably list that as Damage, Xd of Y damage (Z, -%), otherwise it is going to confuse folks.

[Raekai]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

This really needs to be prefaced in the beginning of the thread because it's such a far deviation from how the rules actually work. That said I really don't have a problem being able to toss a 3d Fireball for 6 energy. In fact, in most DF-esque games this should be a FEATURE, not a bug.

Originally Posted by Raekai

This is more of a DF-level compendium. It's for common magic which is good in a full-blown fantasy setting. Add and remove greater effects to fit these rituals to what you need. For missile spells, I added in a lesser control effect since I was getting rid of the greater on those. Some spells are missing certain modifiers (usually range) because those are generally use-dependent.

6 energy just seemed too cheap... 11 feels comfortable. Especially when comparing that 6 energy to other small spells. People can feel free to throw that away.

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

Hmmm. I'd probably list that as Damage, Xd of Y damage (Z, -%), otherwise it is going to confuse folks.

Great idea! I'll fix that up when I can!

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Raekai

6 energy just seemed too cheap... 11 feels comfortable. Especially when comparing that 6 energy to other small spells. People can feel free to throw that away.

Well then.

Originally Posted by Raekai

Great idea! I'll fix that up when I can!

:-)

[Raekai]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

Well then.

I can't tell if that was a good or bad "well then"... :(

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Raekai

I can't tell if that was a good or bad "well then"... :(

It's fine. You did really good work. Explanations make things better. I must have read over yours is all. :)