MA campaigns and your experience

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Just memory; I remember Lucy van Pelt threatening one of the other characters—it might have been Linus—with a "judo chop." But I don't have collected Peanuts on my shelves. But I remember seeing it a long time before Austin Powers was thought of. Can't quote you sources, though.

Bill Stoddard

I know I heard it as a child, and I'm certainly not young enough for that movie to have been from then.

[Gold & Appel Inc]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Just memory; I remember Lucy van Pelt threatening one of the other characters—it might have been Linus—with a "judo chop." But I don't have collected Peanuts on my shelves. But I remember seeing it a long time before Austin Powers was thought of. Can't quote you sources, though.

Bill Stoddard

As an oldskool Peanuts fan with no books handy (they're sitting in my Dad's collection 2,500 miles from here), I can soft/anecdotally back this up. In GURPS and realistic terms, she would probably have delivered a DX Punch or Brawling-Default Hammer Fist if she followed through on it, but Lucy actually said that.

[Peter V. Dell'Orto]

That's good to know, but "Peanuts" wouldn't denote common acceptance of the term outside of a humorous situation. I was wondering if it was ever stated serious. Karate chop certainly was.

[trooper6]

Google NGrams has the phrase "judo chop" being used starting about 1952 reaching its high point in 1972. So is certainly pre-dates Austin Powers.

Some examples:
"In a pre-bout interview Tuesday (15) night with Duke Keomuka, Japanese wrestler from Houston, Boland was on the receiving end of a judo chop to the neck that knocked him across the ring."
--"KRLD-TV Boland bowled by Jap" Billboard Magazine, Jan 26 1952, pg. 4

There are a lot more examples on the NGrams.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Toadkiller_Dog

That's good to know, but "Peanuts" wouldn't denote common acceptance of the term outside of a humorous situation. I was wondering if it was ever stated serious. Karate chop certainly was.

I'm assuming that it was used by people ignorant of the actual martial arts. However, the fact that it was in somewhat common use is evidence toward my claim that judo was somewhat familiar in the United States in the Cold War era, and therefore could be available to an American MMA combatant.

Bill Stoddard

[trooper6]

Originally Posted by whswhs

I'm assuming that it was used by people ignorant of the actual martial arts. However, the fact that it was in somewhat common use is evidence toward my claim that judo was somewhat familiar in the United States in the Cold War era, and therefore could be available to an American MMA combatant.

Bill Stoddard

Indeed, oh and also according to wikipedia there were 5 American competitors in Judo in the 1964 Olympics. So...Judo was already widespread enough by 1964 to be in the Olympics. It certainly would be available to American cold war combatants.

[D10]

By the time the cold war happened Brazil already had a strong Vale Tudo scene because of the gracie family.

they used to raid other style dojos and challenge the toughest guys to an no holds barred fight, and almost everytime they beat them with their jiu jitsu, this caused the gym to lose prestige and the students flocked to the gracie academies.

At the same time, the marters of all these karate, muai thay, TKD, wrestling, etc... gyms, started crosstraining with each other and even some jiu jitsu masters left the gracie mafia and teached them some moves, lots of people hated the gracies around this time.

As a result we had something similar to modern MMA 30-40 years before it really happened, albeit much smaller, niche, and quite hidden from mainstream.

[quarkstomper]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Judo is possible. Judo was trendy in the United States in that era. It actually seems to have referred to a range of Japanese martial arts (which pretty much were "martial arts" as far as most Americans knew); one of the blows that GURPS classes under Karate was then called a "judo chop."

Bill Stoddar

I think there was an episode of Jonny Quest where Hadji employs a judo throw. Jonny is impressed and asks Hadji where he learned it. "From a Marine," Hadji replies.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by whswhs

I'm assuming that it was used by people ignorant of the actual martial arts. However, the fact that it was in somewhat common use is evidence toward my claim that judo was somewhat familiar in the United States in the Cold War era, and therefore could be available to an American MMA combatant.

Bill Stoddard

Note that judo has been an Olympic sport since 1964 (with the exception of 1968, when it was absent), so it would be available during much of the Cold War era to pretty much any nationality. It was commonplace in Icelandic gyms since before I was born and I really doubt that the US, with all their immigrants and their huge population, was behind us in this.

On the other hand, a Far East origin is not necessary for something to count as a martial art. Boxing and catch/shoot wrestling are just as good or better than many exotic martial arts as a foundation for an MMA fighter. Even Graeco-Roman wrestling is a decent beginning and probably about as good as judo.

[Peter V. Dell'Orto]

Originally Posted by whswhs

I'm assuming that it was used by people ignorant of the actual martial arts. However, the fact that it was in somewhat common use is evidence toward my claim that judo was somewhat familiar in the United States in the Cold War era, and therefore could be available to an American MMA combatant.

Is that really under dispute? Check Martial Arts, page 8, under "1930s" - by the 30s Judo was all over the world, and widely practiced. You don't need to wait until the Cold War.