Conditions for bonus against class or race

[Geestkraker]

During a match against some friends loud arguments couldn't settle a dispute, even if the owner of the game (me) wanted to overrule the dispute with what he thought was logical consistency.

Dispute over (supposed) logical (in)consistency:
If a monster has +6 bonus against elves, but the player who faced the monster is not an elf, and he gets help from one who is elf. Does the bonus count against the elf? (And does it count against the elf only?)

If it does, what would happen if an elf face a monster who has +6 against elves, and then receives help from another player? Why would the bonus then count against the helper even if that helper is *not* an elf?

I suggested that logical consistency could not permid both to be true.

If my view is false, please explain why. And I can't understand why I would be the first in the world to spot that inviting contradiction.


Regards from a ghost hacker

(And then I want to complain that a word like "against" can't be a tag to this thread. I insist that the word against can be a tag to this thread!)

[Nipaah]

the +6 against elves is given to the monster, so it's not against a certain player, it's for the whole combat as a whole as long as there is an elf in the combat.

This means that if the player starting the fight is an elf, even if you get a non-elf helper, you're still an elf and the monster is still ****** at you.

If you are not an elf, and get help from an elf, the monster will get angry because now an elf is around, and he gets his +6.

There is really no contradiction, the bonuses against races or classes counts as long as someone in the fight is the required class/race, nomatter if it's the helper or the person who stumbled upon the monster.

Ofcourse I'm no official, but this is completely how I understand it, if you're still not satisfied I'm sure there will be an official reply soon enough

[Clipper]

It's actually covered in the Rules too:

Originally Posted by Munchkin Rules

The special abilities or vulnerabilities of the monster also apply to your helper, and vice versa. . . But if you are facing the Drooling Slime and an Elf helps you, the monster’s combat strength is increased by 4 (unless you, too, are an Elf and the monster’s combat strength has already been increased).

And note that you don't apply a monster's combat strength to each munchkin individually. You are calculating the combat strength of the munchkins versus the combat strength of the monsters. Treat each as sides in the battle. That particular monster sees an Elf, so the strength it adds to its side is increased. A monster with a weakness is treated the same way.

[Geestkraker]

Originally Posted by Nipaah

the +6 against elves is given to the monster, so it's not against a certain player, it's for the whole combat as a whole as long as there is an elf in the combat.

This means that if the player starting the fight is an elf, even if you get a non-elf helper, you're still an elf and the monster is still ****** at you.

If you are not an elf, and get help from an elf, the monster will get angry because now an elf is around, and he gets his +6.

There is really no contradiction, the bonuses against races or classes counts as long as someone in the fight is the required class/race, nomatter if it's the helper or the person who stumbled upon the monster.

Ofcourse I'm no official, but this is completely how I understand it, if you're still not satisfied I'm sure there will be an official reply soon enough

But at least it counts against both in both situations. That is logical consistency. Thanks.

[Nipaah]

Originally Posted by Geestkraker

But at least it counts against both in both situations. That is logical consistency. Thanks.

Yeah, as long as there is an elf, it'll count toward both since the player and helper is on the same side. Do like Clipper said, consider there being 2 sides in the combat, if a monster see any elf at all on the opposite side, it'll get the bonus.

[Enzzo]

Also note that a monster who gets +6 against Elves will not get +12 when fighting against 2 Elves; he only gets +6.