Using larger power cells

[Synapse]

Question:

Suppose I have a laser pistol of some description (detailed in UltraTech).
That's 33 shots on a C-cell.
In theory, you would have no problem carrying a D-cell in your belt and connecting it by cord to your gun to get ten times the number of shots right?
But here's the thing... is it legal?

The rules detail jury-rigging larger cells by using electronics (or engineering as the case may be) to "combine" smaller cells into larger ones, but nowhere does it say it's legal (or illegal for that matter) to emulate masses of smaller cells with a larger one.

Assuming that's fair, would it still be ok if I were to haul an even larger cell (E+-cell) or a generator?
That's suddenly within the realm of effectively inexhaustable power, and if you look at weapons that use the limited number of shot's as their main drawback, those guns suddenly become incredibly viable, with no drawback (besides overheat) to you going full auto every turn.

Am I worrying to much about balance issues that "aren't there"?

[Langy]

If the item is built to support it, then you can just use a larger power cell (or hook directly to the grid) with no skill roll or anything.

You'd need to either use an adapter of some kind or jury-rig a solution in order to use a bigger power cell in place of a smaller one in something that isn't specifically built to support it - just try sticking a power cord or a car battery into a flashlight some time. It doesn't quite work out, does it?

[Synapse]

You are right of course.

A follow up question would then be...
How would such extra compatibility affect the cost of a gadget or (in this case) weapon?
Or could I (for instance) just state that my heavy X-Ray pistol runs on D-Cells instead of 2C when i purchase it?

[Anaraxes]

I'd model the converter as an extra device, rather than something built into the weapon. The designers of the converter presumably attempt to provide you with a standard interface for the smaller cell on the end of a cable in order to work with as many standard devices as possible, as well as letting you plug in the usual larger cell.

Cost and weight, probably significant. You need a box to actually do the power conversion, probably a way to dump waste heat (because the conversion won't be free), cables to connect the large cell + converter to the small cell device. Maybe size and cost of the larger power cell.

Modern examples of DC-DC converters:
https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...ac.6arU9IuGlQc

[Synapse]

Also a good idea!

So if I were to house rule this, a gadget that uses c-cells cannot use d-cells without a power adapter to make the d-cell c-power friendly, this adapter would be the same size as the larger of the two cell types involved and cost the same (?). It might have the drawback of 20% energy loss during conversion (?).
Pros: x8 shots. (or in my scenario, where I replace 2C it would be x4)
Cons: x20 cost for energy solution.

This can be built into the weapon if you must using combined gadget rules (UT16), but that would make for a very bulky pistol and you'd be better off with a bigger gun.

Sounds good to me, I'm sure my GM would agree.


But something is still bugging me.
What do you guys* think about changing the number of shots like this, could this cause balance issues?

*: ...who have played this game much more than I have...

[chandley]

If you are using power cells, Id gloss over waste heat issues... because power cells in normal use gloss over waste heat issues :)

Whatever lets a powercell store and move around the energy it has can be applied to the adapter. Slap a tiny computer and its 2 A cells into a generic gadget and call it the adapter. Add 1/10th the weight of the cell its adapting TO, to represent the cable and plug. Call it a day. Modern day adapters suggest the cables on both ends (the one pulling from a donor power cell and the one going to the gadget being powered) are swappable. Memory metal and the like might let a more expensive adapter switch what it adapts on the fly. Utility Fog should be able to build an adapter between pretty much anything.

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by chandley

If you are using power cells, Id gloss over waste heat issues... because power cells in normal use gloss over waste heat issues :).

I see no reason you'd *have* any waste heat issues. You aren't doing any additional energy conversion here, all you are doing is changing the shape of the connectors. Maybe if you were adapting it to plug into a wall outlet.

And I don't see any particular balance problems either. You don't have to stop shooting for a second in a ridiculously long firefight to reload another power cell, so what?

[Synapse]

A tiny computer is just 50$ and 0,05 lbs, cabling in this case would be 0,1 lbs at most and cable-weights is (in my mind) an unnecessary degree of resolution.

Perhaps one can use both solutions.
Flatly saying that for +50$ and +0,1 lbs you can have a gun or gadget use a different kind of power source instead of the usual (listed in rulebook) one.
Or you can buy a generic external adapter that weighs and costs like the larger cell to emulate a smaller one.

Guess I have to go to my GM for the final verdict.
But since most tech in the TL11 setting we're playing is clean, near lossless-efficient and solid state, I suspect he'd just handwave the adapter.

The point is that no one objected to the idea, that it wasn't unbalancing, and that I hadn't missed some official ruling.
(Evil guys* are always neat freaks)(*: Like me)

[Anthony]

Given that you can use the same power cell on devices that run for seconds, and device that run for hours, stepping down the power output of a larger cell is not going to be a problem. The major jury-rig is just to hook up the wires in a way that doesn't electrocute the user, and possibly disable the safety system that prevents you from shooting with the battery case open.

[RyanW]

For simplicity, I would just say the adapter and cabling weigh the same as the original battery. That way loaded weight of the weapon does not change.