What is Cardiel?

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

I meant as a label.

Oh.

I think it's just that "fantasy written by an author whose mind is fully in the 20th (or 21st) century" is a somewhat broader label than "new weird".

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

I think it's just that "fantasy written by an author whose mind is fully in the 20th (or 21st) century" is a somewhat broader label than "new weird".

I'm not sure that "Postmodern" is all that useful as a label in general. On the other hand I think I prefer narrower genre lables than broad ones. Sure Meiville writes "Postmodern fiction" but really so does Stieg Larrson.

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

I'm not sure that "Postmodern" is all that useful as a label in general. On the other hand I think I prefer narrower genre lables than broad ones. Sure Meiville writes "Postmodern fiction" but really so does Stieg Larrson.

I prefer narrower labels too. But sometimes it's important to point out that there is (at least) one flaw in LOTR.

[Captain-Captain]

Originally Posted by Stormcrow

Each of the countries in Yrth represents a particular genre of fantasy. Megalos is high fantasy; Caithness is Arthurian fantasy; Al-Wazif is Arabian Nights; etc.

What is the genre for Cardiel? Its theme seems to be a live-and-let-live mixture of other cultures, but does it correspond to a particular fantasy genre?

Cardiel is medieval United Federation of planets to Megalos' Empire. Much tolerance of other cultures etc.

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by Captain-Captain

Cardiel is medieval United Federation of planets to Megalos' Empire. Much tolerance of other cultures etc.

Or as I think of it, medieval fantasy without most of the "annoying medieval stuff." ;-)

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

"Modern fantasy" makes some sense, as a time period and world desginator, but it can also be interpreted differently. For instance one could take off from the statement that LOTR was written by a man born in the 19th century but who lived mentally in the 18th (if not 17th!) century, and then claim that "modern fantasy" is fantasy that differs from Tolkien in that it is written by someone of a modern mindset, e.g. China Mieville.

"Modern" itself is equivocal in meaning. For example, one of my lj friends, eldritch_hobbit, is a literature professor who's about to teach a course on the early history of science fiction. She starts with "its modern beginnings," which turns out to mean Frankenstein. That's more or less in the historical sense, in which "modernity" begins roughly with the Royal Society and the first steam engines (before that you have "early modern," formerly known as Renaissance). There is also the terminology of art, in which "modern art" begins somewhere between impressionism and cubism.

In any case, I don't think "modern fantasy" simply equals "modern" + "fantasy," any more than "steampunk" equals "steam" + "punk" (a lot of steampunk is not "punk" in any meaningful sense). Language is full of idioms: expressions in which word A plus word B add up to entirely new meaning C.

Bill Stoddard

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by Rocket Man

Or as I think of it, medieval fantasy without most of the "annoying medieval stuff." ;-)

That sounds like what I'd call de-medievalized fantasy. Or D&D-Land.

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by whswhs

In any case, I don't think "modern fantasy" simply equals "modern" + "fantasy," any more than "steampunk" equals "steam" + "punk" (a lot of steampunk is not "punk" in any meaningful sense). Language is full of idioms: expressions in which word A plus word B add up to entirely new meaning C.

The only Steampunk I've actually consumed has been "The Difference Engine", but I've gotten the indirect impression that it is at best one of very few steampunk works that actually contain any cyberpunk atmosphere or thought.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

The only Steampunk I've actually consumed has been "The Difference Engine", but I've gotten the indirect impression that it is at best one of very few steampunk works that actually contain any cyberpunk atmosphere or thought.

Even that wasn't actually all that "punk"; it was "-punk" as the suffix is used in "cyberpunk." And a lot of contemporary steampunk is actually somewhat romantic/cinematic alternate history. With airships.

Bill Stoddard

[robkelk]

Originally Posted by whswhs

... alternate history. With airships.

According to at least one of Ken Hite's "Suppresed Transmissions," that's redundant...