Generation Ships

[Earther]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Cryonics does not violate modern scientific understanding; it simply isn't reversible with current technologies. There is some skepticism as to whether revival will be achievable, but it isn't impossible.

Do you believe FTL travel isn't impossible?

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Superscience (as used by GURPS) is not "Can we do so now?", it is "Does this violate modern scientific understanding?" Cryonics does not violate modern scientific understanding; it simply isn't reversible with current technologies. There is some skepticism as to whether revival will be achievable, but it isn't impossible.

You can freeze a corpse, but you can't resurrect him sounds like impossible to me. But not our setting.

[Sindri]

Originally Posted by Earther

Navy crewmembers have the same problems that civilians have. Same percentage of crime and types of crime as the city a ship is based at. A submarine crew is more isolated. But they too have tenders to support them. A trip to the Moon and back used to be a week. The crew was on its own except for radio comm with Houston. What long-term ship rides are there currently? Cruise ships are just for a week at most, and they can't handle basic reservations, food prep, or crowd control at times. They want passengers gone from the ship as quickly as possible (no matter what) to get a ship ready again for another "fun" trip.

A long-term ride would need to be much better planned for, and not need assistance once launched.

Of course, if the ship has FTL drives, no planning is necessary once again. :)

I don't see why it matters what modern travel times are. People don't choose one week because it is a magical line past which craziness happens. Generally either you want to get there as fast as possible or things have been seen to work more efficiently by limited time alone than by developing methods to deal with the problem. Solving the problems of generation ships has barely been touched on so far on Earth. Cruise ships really seem like anti generation ships so not particularly relevant as a limitation.

FTL is off topic.

Originally Posted by Earther

Who has lived through it so far?

Not the determinance of superscience.

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

If you have the technology, rotating people in and out of cryogenic suspension would be a good way of maintaining continuity and keeping the ship's society from going off the rails

If you have the technology. Life extension works too.

Originally Posted by Earther

Do you believe FTL travel isn't impossible?

How is that relevant at all to whether cryogenics is superscience? FTL is pretty much superscience. Even the most realistic speculation requires quite unusual circumstances that we aren't sure exist.

[Flyndaran]

With or without medical life extension, you're going to end up with a boat load of old farts running the show.
There are going to have to be ways to kick doddering leaders out, otherwise you end up with Stromm Thurmond at 100 drooling on himself not knowing where he was 1/2 the time voting on things far more important than what flavor of jello he wants.

[Sindri]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

With or without medical life extension, you're going to end up with a boat load of old farts running the show.
There are going to have to be ways to kick doddering leaders out, otherwise you end up with Stromm Thurmond at 100 drooling on himself not knowing where he was 1/2 the time voting on things far more important than what flavor of jello he wants.

In the particular case I think his competitor being voted for or him being outmaneuvered by political enemies or something else depending on the government would remove him. Really I think the problem with "a boat load of old farts running the show" isn't so much competency as the dissatisfaction of the younger people who feel they are not being represented.

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by Sindri

In the particular case I think his competitor being voted for or him being outmaneuvered by political enemies or something else depending on the government would remove him. Really I think the problem with "a boat load of old farts running the show" isn't so much competency as the dissatisfaction of the younger people who feel they are not being represented.

But on a generation ship, what is so controversial that the young need one of their group to push forward? But of course I was just mentioning the demographic issue. The cultural issue would almost certainly exacerbate it.

[Sindri]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

But on a generation ship, what is so controversial that the young need one of their group to push forward? But of course I was just mentioning the demographic issue. The cultural issue would almost certainly exacerbate it.

If there isn't something reasonable then some people will come up with an issue for a controversy.

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by Sindri

If there isn't something reasonable then some people will come up with an issue for a controversy.

Demand a vote to make dubstep the ship's official music? Those bastards!

[Danukian]

Originally Posted by Earther

Navy crewmembers have the same problems that civilians have. Same percentage of crime and types of crime as the city a ship is based at. A submarine crew is more isolated. But they too have tenders to support them. A trip to the Moon and back used to be a week. The crew was on its own except for radio comm with Houston. What long-term ship rides are there currently? Cruise ships are just for a week at most, and they can't handle basic reservations, food prep, or crowd control at times. They want passengers gone from the ship as quickly as possible (no matter what) to get a ship ready again for another "fun" trip.

A long-term ride would need to be much better planned for, and not need assistance once launched.

Of course, if the ship has FTL drives, no planning is necessary once again. :)

If you read the post I quoted, that was my point: a cruise ship has those issues because their entire mission is getting you off the ship, a Navy cruise plans for longer voyages and has far fewer problems, a generational ship needs to plan for generations, including political policies and what to do with the geezers. My suggestion? Soilent Green Ale! Aged to perfection.

[NorphTehDwarf]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

The first generation will whine about what food isn't on the ship. But the future ones will only know what they have, and won't miss what they never had.

300 years after Landing, there's a small cult dedicated to discovering how to make the divine Ambrosia that is Cheez Whiz.