[DF 1, 2] Which Four PC Templates?

[thulben]

Originally Posted by RyanW

A knight.
A bard.
An artificer with good combat skills.
A very eccentric cleric of a very chaotic god of messengers and rogues who has focused heavily on travel related spells.

In 1072 a crack commando unit was sent to prison by a royal court for a crime they didn't commit. These men promptly escaped from a maximum security dungeon to the Imperial City underground. Today, still wanted by the government, they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire the DF-Team.

So, I'm putting this together as a one-shot. Except instead of a cleric, I think I'm going to sub in a wizard-thief driven mad by his thaumatological endeavors. Of course, now I have to figure out how to make the thief and the artificer not step on each others' toes...

[Greg 1]

This thread has been very enlightening. I think that my ways of thinking about dungeoneering parties has been rooted in ancient assumptions and old games.

If I had had to hand out four pre-generated characters to new-people to hit a dungeon with, I'd have made them knight, barbarian, healer cleric and wizard. The knight keeps the monster busy while the barbarian helps her to hack it down, the cleric is curing and buffing and the wizard is there because you have to have a wizard. Then I'd wish all night that the party had a thief.

Maybe I think this way because in AD&D, a low-level melee character was so much more useful than low-level thieves or magical-types. Having a second fighter-type in the party was a big help.

[Greg 1]

Originally Posted by Kromm

So the party has to pick a specialty that plays to the strengths of their fringe types and roll with it.

I like very much the idea of specializing parties. Variety is the spice of gaming, and it keeps every party from feeling the same.

[lachimba]

Originally Posted by Greg 1

This thread has been very enlightening. I think that my ways of thinking about dungeoneering parties has been rooted in ancient assumptions and old games.

If I had had to hand out four pre-generated characters to new-people to hit a dungeon with, I'd have made them knight, barbarian, healer cleric and wizard. The knight keeps the monster busy while the barbarian helps her to hack it down, the cleric is curing and buffing and the wizard is there because you have to have a wizard. Then I'd wish all night that the party had a thief.

Maybe I think this way because in AD&D, a low-level melee character was so much more useful than low-level thieves or magical-types. Having a second fighter-type in the party was a big help.

Well you could go Knight, Cleric, Wizard and Thief and have the thief sneak and make stealth and ranged attacks during combat.

[Kromm]

Something to bear in mind is that even when built using DF-style templates, GURPS PCs aren't as narrowly focused as low-level class-based types. In particular, non-warriors are still useful in a pure, physical fight, as they aren't nerfed to ineffectiveness by a class system. In a cleric-knight-thief-wizard party, the templates as written give you these capabilities over and above a noncombatant:

Cleric: ST 12, DX 12, HT 12; optional 20 points in ST, DX, HT, or Signature Gear (like awesome weapons); melee weapon skills at 13-15; and a ranged combat skill at 12-14.

Knight: ST 14, DX 14, HT 13; Combat Reflexes and High Pain Threshold; optional 60 points in ST, DX, HT, HP, Basic Speed, Enhanced Defenses, Fit, Hard to Kill, Hard to Subdue, Signature Gear, Striking ST, Weapon Bond, or Weapon Master; melee weapon skills at 15-20; a ranged combat skill at 14-16; and unarmed skills at 14-15.

Thief: ST 11, DX 15, HT 11; Basic Move 7; optional 30 points in DX, Basic Speed, Basic Move, Ambidexterity, Combat Reflexes, Enhanced Dodge, Peripheral Vision, Signature Gear, or Striking ST; melee weapon skills at 14-15; a ranged combat skill at 13-15; and an unarmed skill at 15.

Wizard: DX 12, HT 11; optional 30 points in DX or Signature Gear; melee weapon skills at 13-14; and a ranged combat skill at 12-14.

Fundamentally, any of the non-knight types should be handing fodder monsters their butts in a straight-up fight. The knight's big advantage is more options and higher skill levels, which only really start to matter against more serious threats. If the GM is good about starting things off "traditionally" and making early encounters ones where the knight shines through Rapid Strikes to take down more fodder, then fighting is covered. Whereas healing, stealing, and magicking are rather more specialized.

Also, a cleric who goes for more ST and HT, a thief who takes the route of Combat Reflexes and Enhanced Dodge, and a wizard who invests in more DX and the Signature Gear needed for a magic weapon (esp. one with Penetrating Weapon) can all do their customary duties but bring more melee power to the table, if the party is small enough to need that.

[Bruno]

The pure combat templates also can take on three, five, etc fodder at a time, even when surrounded, while the "off-combat" templates should probably keep their backs to a wall and perhaps stick closer together. We got reminded about that last night :)

[ULFGARD]

Originally Posted by Kromm

Magnificent Six (The Outdoorsmen): "Haunted woods? Orc-infested swamps? Fire-ant invasion? No problem! We'll track down the problem, fill it with arrows, and bring you its head!" Barbarian (outdoors melee specialist), Druid (outdoors magic specialist), Holy Warrior (deals with haunted woods, provides extra muscle and healing), Scout (outdoors missile specialist), Swashbuckler (fast runner and extra melee power), and Wizard (additional magical support, esp. with elemental spells and Mystic Mist).

Fun group. Almost like many lower powered games I have GM-ed in the past.

Six Six Six (The Evils): "Ultimate power can't be shared, but we can certainly cooperate in our efforts to find and pilfer the secrets of lost civilizations." Barbarian (huge thug, for intimidation value), Evil Cleric (expert on evil religion), Scholar (researches evil artifacts, magic, etc. and instantly "learns" evil magic from books), Thief (steals what's found, and what other delvers find), Unholy Warrior (general blackguard and expert on evil beings), and Wizard (expert on evil magic, liches, etc.).

What's wrong with me? But this seems like an AWESOME group. I may use them as bad guys. They'd make an interesting PC group, though!