Transhuman Space 2110, 2130, 2200

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

Yes, and the virtual neurons are subject to modification so that needing sleep, getting bored, and imperfect memory are mitigated or eliminated.

Again that assumes sleep, boredom, and imperfect memory are fixable flaws rather than features inherent in earth type biology.
I don't believe that one can "fix" them without so modifying the digital biology as to be easier to just chuck the whole thing and start from scratch.
(This is my grandfather's axe. I've replaced the head twice, and the shaft five times, but it's still the same axe.) To use a metaphor.

[jeff_wilson]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

Again that assumes sleep, boredom, and imperfect memory are fixable flaws rather than features inherent in earth type biology.
I don't believe that one can "fix" them without so modifying the digital biology as to be easier to just chuck the whole thing and start from scratch.

Canonically, you can. If you want to discard such an essential part of canon, you are of course free to do so, but this is not the forum.

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

Canonically, you can. If you want to discard such an essential part of canon, you are of course free to do so, but this is not the forum.

So just a few more ridiculous things from THS, a supposedly hard sci fi setting? They just keep cropping up, don't they?
Oh, well, still better than all the others in its genre.

[jeff_wilson]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

So just a few more ridiculous things from THS, a supposedly hard sci fi setting?

They're not ridicuous, as there are creatures of earthly biology that apparently do without human-like sleep (sharks, dolphins), imperfect memory (Marilu Henner), and bordeom (sharks again).

[Astromancer]

Frankly I think Cyborgs that look fully human would be the norm. Flesh is fun, and humans like pleasure. An AI human hybred, which wouldn't be odd or impossible in this setting would have many advantages and a great deal of fun/pleasure.

Some AIs might get out into "Star Swarms" and found "Pure AI" societies. But humans will stay mainly human and/or hybred because of pleasure, not cultural stagnation.

[Phil Masters]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

They're not ridicuous, as there are creatures of earthly biology that apparently do without human-like sleep (sharks, dolphins), imperfect memory (Marilu Henner), and bordeom (sharks again).

One radical/dubious parahuman design that I can see the likes of the Red Duncanites contemplating would incorporate dolphin-style sleeplessness. As I understand it (warning; not an expert; may be laughed off the thread within three posts by an expert), dolphins seem to accomplish this by having large brains, frankly rather inefficient for their size by most mammalian standards, but capable of running something akin to consciousness on half power while the other half does the housekeeping that most mammals do in sleep.

So, steering back somewhere near the thread topic - in 2040, the Duncanites introduce their MEKON-class parahuman template, which toggles between IQ 150 and IQ 80 instead of sleeping. And the last of their transhumanist fans in the inner system listen to the first interviews with a 14-year-old alpha-release MEKON, look at the portrait holos, and say "okay, that's a bit creepy".

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by Phil Masters

...
So, steering back somewhere near the thread topic - in 2040, the Duncanites introduce their MEKON-class parahuman template, which toggles between IQ 150 and IQ 80 instead of sleeping. And the last of their transhumanist fans in the inner system listen to the first interviews with a 14-year-old alpha-release MEKON, look at the portrait holos, and say "okay, that's a bit creepy".

Horses have two types of sleep. The one they need every day, a kind of light sleep, that they can still eat and stand while under. And the more important one, R.E.M., that they must lie down for, but only a couple of hours per week.

Your idea shouldn't be impossible, as real humans can do amazing things while sleepwalking. I've had entire conversations while asleep, and no one noticed. I even apologized for falling asleep while asleep.

[mindstalk]

I hadn't heard of OCD with perfect memory, but Luria's patient S. was described as being very uncreative, IIRC.

If we're not sure why living orgnanisms need sleep, it might be premature to say that SAI won't need something like sleep, whether human-like or via something like hemispheric partial-functioning.

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

That's what I thought the singularity meant. That everything human from bio-people to "uploaded" people will be vastly outpaced by pure A.I. program entities. What we create will become like gods to that which descends from us.

Vinge's Singularity is at core just the existence of superhuman intelligence -- too smart for the SF author to write about. Even the exponential rise of technology is derivative of that. And Vinge had four pathways: pure AI, brain-computer linkages, brain-brain linked groupminds, and pure biological enhancement via drugs or genes or development. The last shows up in his novel _Tatja Grimm's World_.

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

Again that assumes sleep, boredom, and imperfect memory are fixable flaws rather than features inherent in earth type biology.
I don't believe that one can "fix" them without so modifying the digital biology as to be easier to just chuck the whole thing and start from scratch.
(This is my grandfather's axe. I've replaced the head twice, and the shaft five times, but it's still the same axe.) To use a metaphor.

If I'm a ghost, then even if it's easier to start from scratch, so what? I don't want to make some scratch SAI, I want me, my personality and memories, to get the benefits of improvement. So I'd opt for modifying my digital biology, because that improves *me*.

Obvious candidate for Singularity-level social change: xoxing becomes accepted. Probably in only place at first, say EU or US due to a court decision or some shift in public opinion.

There's a couple of approaches to thinking about the Singularity. One is to take the more radical ideas seriously, whether to embrace of dismiss them, ideas about hard takeoff and godlike AI taking over the world. The other is to think about more realistic transformative technologies, maybe relabeling it a Cognitive Revolution, and THS is already getting into that, with uploading and SAI; just go further. The ability to design minds, in both capability and in loyalty; the ability to duplicate them. Skilled labor as free software, mass produced Einsteins, immortality of personality and memory, experimenting with new cognitive architectures (what happens if you link two digital brains at a neural level, a la the corpus callosum? Or even two meat brains, via some wireless transmission between implants?)

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

They're not ridicuous, as there are creatures of earthly biology that apparently do without human-like sleep (sharks, dolphins), imperfect memory (Marilu Henner), and bordeom (sharks again).

Dolphins still sleep just in a very odd way, one hemisphere at a time, so they can still swim in circles and come up to breathe. It still takes them out of consciousness, so effectively it's the same as normal sleep.

Holy Moly! I had never heard of perfect autobiographical recall that wasn't accompanied by severe O.C.D. I take back my objection on that subject.
Still, I think forgetting is a healthy defense mechanism.

Boredom is a lack of mental stimulation causing stress. Sharks are simple enough that swimming and looking around is using enough of their brain power to stave off boredom, not that we would know.

[Astromancer]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

Dolphins still sleep just in a very odd way, one hemisphere at a time, so they can still swim in circles and come up to breathe. It still takes them out of consciousness, so effectively it's the same as normal sleep.

The was a character, a villain, in Consider Phlebas who had a brain mod that worked that way. Or something like it.