[TL] Iron/Steel Bracers, Greaves TL?

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by DanHoward

"Smaller pieces of iron plate, such as helmets and greaves, are available starting at TL2" p. 108.

That doesn't mean they were historically common though.

Historical armorers seem to have operated on a priority basis and iron plate defenses for the lower arm and lower leg were the last parts of full plate to appear more or less at the end of TL3.

Then halfway through TL4 they were the first bits of plate to disappear too.

That was after the threat of mass arrow barrages had disappeaed though. The Greek and Roman preference for bronze greaves may have been because the lower legs were the only part not protected from arrow barrages by the large shields.

[DanHoward]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

That doesn't mean they were historically common though.

They were common enough to be classified as TL2. It is a "mature" technology. The Romans used iron helmets and greaves extensively. If you want to be fussy then add +1 TL to hardened steel items.

Historical armorers seem to have operated on a priority basis and iron plate defenses for the lower arm and lower leg were the last parts of full plate to appear more or less at the end of TL3.

Greaves were one of the earliest to be strapped over mail - starting in the middle of the 13th century. Elbows and knees are around the same time.

That was after the threat of mass arrow barrages had disappeaed though. The Greek and Roman preference for bronze greaves may have been because the lower legs were the only part not protected from arrow barrages by the large shields.

That was likely why they wore greaves but they wouldn't have cared whether they were iron or bronze. Both were worn and provided good protection from arrows.

[Verjigorm]

IT's not likely the roman greaves were worn for protection from arrows: the romans had a habit of only wearing the left greave.

[DanHoward]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

IT's not likely the roman greaves were worn for protection from arrows: the romans had a habit of only wearing the left greave.

Polybius says that some of the hastati wore only one greave. He implies that these men were too poor to be able to afford two of them. If this is the case then the threat is irrelevant since they wore all the armour they could afford. The principes and triarii wore two greaves.

[Verjigorm]

Originally Posted by DanHoward

Polybius says that some of the hastati wore only one greave. He implies that these men were too poor to be able to afford two of them. If this is the case then the threat is irrelevant. They wore all the armour they could afford.

That may be the case, and it could just be that my secondary source was taking liberties with Polybius. Be that as it may, I don't think arrow fire was a prime motive for greaves amongst the Romans or Greeks, but especially the greeks: as hoplite warfare evolves and light troops play bigger roles, you see less greaves.

[DanHoward]

Skirmishers probably don't wear greaves because they interfere with running.

[doulos05]

Originally Posted by DanHoward

Skirmishers probably don't wear greaves because they interfere with running.

Right but more skirmishers means hoplites should continue to wear greaves because there are more ranged weapons on the field. However, the evidence suggests that they wore fewer greaves.

[Verjigorm]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

That may be the case, and it could just be that my secondary source was taking liberties with Polybius. Be that as it may, I don't think arrow fire was a prime motive for greaves amongst the Romans or Greeks, but especially the greeks: as hoplite warfare evolves and light troops play bigger roles, you see less greaves.

Right, but I was under the impression that by the time of the Peloponese wars, hoplite panoply was lighter, and the greaves were often absent. Could be due to welath interactions i guess.

[Agramer]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

That was after the threat of mass arrow barrages had disappeaed though. The Greek and Roman preference for bronze greaves may have been because the lower legs were the only part not protected from arrow barrages by the large shields.

How can that be modeled by RAW?

Since typical Block AD doesnt take that into account.
Thanks

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Agramer

How can that be modeled by RAW?

Since typical Block AD doesnt take that into account.
Thanks

Arrows as commonly used on the battlefield should use random hit location.

Shield blocking of arrows fired en barrage probably shouldn't be allowed in the most realistic campaigns. When dozens, hundreds or even thousands of arrows are coming in on a high arc it's unlikely you can track the one that's coming for you. A highly penalized Vision Roll should be required as a minimum.