[Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor - Page 2

gilbertocarlos · 10-02-2011, 04:29 PM

I suggest using a heavy weapon, a knight with heavy armor is kinda like a soldier with kevlar, and a broadsword is kinda like a pistol, so... you're using the wrong weapon.
But, if you are against a weapon with plate and only have a sword, then, use AOA(strong), grappling, aim for the chinks, or eyes, evaluate, feint etc...

Ts_ · 10-02-2011, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asta Kask

If he has rigid armor, he has chinks sitting in it. Target them.

The OP already mentioned that without an imp attack, targetting chinks is not an option (according to Basic Set at least, not sure what MA says).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

How much encumbrance is Walter carrying? If he's fighting all-out in heavy armor, shouldn't he be worn out pretty soon?

FP loss from fights is only calculated after the fight. Adrenaline and all that, I guess. FP loss is 1+Encumbrance or something like that. The length of the fight doesn't matter unless the fight takes minues, which is unlikely, or less than 10s in which case there seems to be no FP cost (which can actually happen in a 1-on-1 fight like this).

So, I guess the options mentioned above are still the best for Thomas. Or running away and buying a better weapon. ;)

Ts

Napalm · 10-02-2011, 05:17 PM

Okay thanks guys. Guess I was right about most things in basic (i.e. Heavy armor is REALLY effective.)

Thomas basically needs a better weapon or / and needs to try to disarm Walter.

This seems realistic enough it just sort of need getting used to especially when coming froma more "cinematic" ruleset. (We know what I mean ;) )

Ulzgoroth · 10-02-2011, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Napalm

Okay thanks guys. Guess I was right about most things in basic (i.e. Heavy armor is REALLY effective.)

It is if you don't have the means to defeat it, yes. But even so...if anything, it may be a bit weak.

ST 10 is quite weak for a melee fighter, and a broadsword is an pretty weak weapon too (especially the non-thrusting version). If he had ST 12 he'd be a threat to the armored guy, especially if he had a higher-quality sword or an unbalanced weapon.

DanHoward · 10-02-2011, 06:04 PM

In a real fight he wouldn't use a single-handed sword at all unless all of his other weapons were lost or broken. Most fighters had some kind of pole arm - a spear at the very least. His weapon of choice is handy against unarmoured peasants (or in an artificial situation like a duel) but that's about all.

When two armoured people fought they concentrated on grapples and targeting gaps and joints. It is a waste of an attack to aim for the armour. As has been said, Shield Bash is handy too. This should be high on the list for any initial attack.

Landwalker · 10-02-2011, 07:22 PM

I think I may be forgetting some fairly integral rule regarding Shield Bash, so can someone refresh my memory? What is it about Shield Bash that makes it a good option in this situation?

My understanding:

1) A shield bash will do thr-1 cr (or thr cr, for an embossed shield)
2) In order to cause knockback, the attacker has to do [Opponent's ST-2] Crushing damage
3) Walter has ST 14, so Thomas would have to do 12 damage with a thr-1 attack to trigger knockback.
4) Thomas can't do that much damage, even if he's ST 12.

So. What am I missing here?

DanHoward · 10-02-2011, 07:25 PM

I think I mean "shield rush" rather than shield bash. It is a useful first attack agaisnt a heavily armoured foe. I think that the shield's HP rather than its DB should be incorporated into the Slam damage when doing this move.

Diomedes · 10-02-2011, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanHoward

I think I mean "shield rush" rather than shield bash. It is a useful first attack agaisnt a heavily armoured foe. I think that the shield's mass should be incorporated into the Slam damage when doing this move.

Isn't that already approximated in the fact that shield rushes get their DB as a damage bonus?

Edit: Two posts passing in the night....

DanHoward · 10-02-2011, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diomedes

Isn't that already approximated in the fact that shield rushes get their DB as a damage bonus?

Edit: Two posts passing in the night....

Yeah I was editing that part. Low-Tech has a light shield and a heavy shield. Using existing slam rules the light shield does the same damage as a heavy one since they have the same DB. HP (perhaps HP/5) would be a better stat to use and would be more consistent with the rest of the slam rules.

Diomedes · 10-02-2011, 07:45 PM

What about just adding the slammer's encumbrance level to his damage for a slam, since it's not just the mass of the shield but the mass of the entire person behind it?

10-02-2011, 04:29 PM	#11
gilbertocarlos Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Caxias do Sul, Brazil	Re: [Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor I suggest using a heavy weapon, a knight with heavy armor is kinda like a soldier with kevlar, and a broadsword is kinda like a pistol, so... you're using the wrong weapon. But, if you are against a weapon with plate and only have a sword, then, use AOA(strong), grappling, aim for the chinks, or eyes, evaluate, feint etc...

10-02-2011, 05:17 PM	#13
Napalm Join Date: Apr 2009	Re: [Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor Okay thanks guys. Guess I was right about most things in basic (i.e. Heavy armor is REALLY effective.) Thomas basically needs a better weapon or / and needs to try to disarm Walter. This seems realistic enough it just sort of need getting used to especially when coming froma more "cinematic" ruleset. (We know what I mean ;) )

10-02-2011, 06:04 PM	#15
DanHoward Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia	Re: [Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor In a real fight he wouldn't use a single-handed sword at all unless all of his other weapons were lost or broken. Most fighters had some kind of pole arm - a spear at the very least. His weapon of choice is handy against unarmoured peasants (or in an artificial situation like a duel) but that's about all. When two armoured people fought they concentrated on grapples and targeting gaps and joints. It is a waste of an attack to aim for the armour. As has been said, Shield Bash is handy too. This should be high on the list for any initial attack. Last edited by DanHoward; 10-02-2011 at 06:13 PM.

10-02-2011, 07:22 PM	#16
Landwalker Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Cumberland, ME	Re: [Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor I think I may be forgetting some fairly integral rule regarding Shield Bash, so can someone refresh my memory? What is it about Shield Bash that makes it a good option in this situation? My understanding: 1) A shield bash will do thr-1 cr (or thr cr, for an embossed shield) 2) In order to cause knockback, the attacker has to do [Opponent's ST-2] Crushing damage 3) Walter has ST 14, so Thomas would have to do 12 damage with a thr-1 attack to trigger knockback. 4) Thomas can't do that much damage, even if he's ST 12. So. What am I missing here?

10-02-2011, 07:25 PM	#17
DanHoward Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia	Re: [Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor I think I mean "shield rush" rather than shield bash. It is a useful first attack agaisnt a heavily armoured foe. I think that the shield's HP rather than its DB should be incorporated into the Slam damage when doing this move. Last edited by DanHoward; 10-02-2011 at 07:29 PM.

10-02-2011, 07:45 PM	#20
Diomedes Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, TX	Re: [Basic] Questions regarding Heavy Plate Armor What about just adding the slammer's encumbrance level to his damage for a slam, since it's not just the mass of the shield but the mass of the entire person behind it?