Seraphim and Profanity

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Rocket Man

Can he shout at someone to "Open the F'ing door," even though it is impossible that the object has ever been used for copulation?

Isn't the original verb "ficken" Anglo Saxon for "strike together"? In that case I think it might be a fairly literal description of how a door relates to it's frame.

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Isn't the original verb "ficken" Anglo Saxon for "strike together"? In that case I think it might be a fairly literal description of how a door relates to it's frame.

Depends on which etymology you follow. One route traces it back to Scandinavia, rooted in the Norwegian or Swedish word for "to copulate" (and possibly a Swedish dialect term for the male genitalia). Another possibility goes through Germany, where the root word meant to move about restlessly, fidget, or make quick movements back and forth. (It could also refer to scratching an itch, which became a euphamism of its own!) Either way, I think it would be a little difficult to apply a literal usage to the door, though not necessarily impossible.

[Matthias Wasser]

Well, etymology isn't semantics, which is the point, no? A Seraph isn't going to have any more of a problem with "open the ****ing door" than "I don't know nothing!"

[Rocket Man]

And in some cases, the profane statement might be gloriously True. Picture a Seraph demanding entrace to an infernal Tether:

"Open this damned door!!"

[DBloch2012]

Originally Posted by In Nomine Core Rulebook, p. 94

Remember that few Seraphim are stupid; they can “feel” the difference between literal and metaphorical statements.

This little GM Note solves this issue.

As for the idea of profanity causing Dissonance in the Symphony? Laughable.

[Jason]

Personally, I wouldn't make an issue of it in my game. The same word can mean different things in different contexts, and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone at all who takes "motherf*ing door" that literally (though I'd agree that adopting such a flagrantly figurative style of speech may take some training for a Seraph). Along those lines, I wouldn't ding it as a lie if a Seraph used a resonance on someone who said, "He hit me in the nuts!" It's understood that he wasn't carrying a pack of Planters; the Seraph is looking for dishonesty and mistakes, not painful adherence to literalism (even if that comes naturally to them).

Consider too that slang and swears translate between languages more according to deeper meaning than according to literal meaning. Whether you say "nuts" in English or "huevos" (eggs) in Spanish, in the angelic tongue, it all registers as "testicles (spoken in a vulgar tone)."

[Acolyte]

"testicles (spoken in a vulgar tone)."

I love representing celestial speech with these kinds of over(under?)tones.

Also, the quoted phrase would make a good album name for an edgy indie band. *grin*

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by DBloch2012

This little GM Note solves this issue.

Sort of. It means they can recognize when someone else is using a statement literally and when they're using it metaphorically. However, not every Seraph is comfortable with using metaphoric statements themselves. The Angelic Players Guide notes that many Seraphim have to be taught that "How are you doing?" is not a request for every detail of your current state ... that the question does not mean what it sounds like. (This sort of difficulty is also the reason most Seraphim won't say "I'm Stacy Martin," but will instead say something like "People call me Stacy.")

As far as laughable? Not necessarily. Words and ideas have power in the IN world. Careless use of either can be dangerous. You may be right that profanity wouldn't be likely to lead to dissonance, but a Seraph wouldn't necessarily make that a casual assumption.

[DBloch2012]

I always thought it was careless use of Essence that was dangerous for the Symphony.

I do not have the Angelic Player's Guide, as it has not been put up on e23 yet, so I only have the Core Rulebook for my knowledge of Seraphim. It seems to put them in a better light, though, if the APG portrays them as literalistic automatons who need everything pointed out to them like little children.

I would also argue the fact that if you can distinguish between literal and metaphorical in others, you can also distinguish between them in yourself. Though, I do agree that whether you chose to use such knowledge is up to the individual player's interpretation of their character.