Maledictions w/ No die roll required - is this legal?

[JCurwen3]

If you add Cosmic: No die roll required (+100%) to an ability that has Malediction, what happens? Yes, I know it won't remove the resistance roll! Bear with me on this...

The rules exclude it for:

1. "abilities with effects based entirely on margin of success"
   and also
2. "resisted abilities as Mind Control and Maledictions"

(p. P101 - my emphasis added in bold).

Now from reading that, I'm sure the knee-jerk response would be "read it, it says not on Maledictions". Hence this question - read on please!

I know you'd have to add Fixed Duration (+0%) from Psionic Powers, p. 21 to any ability (like Afflictions) that use the MoS to determine duration, which effectively makes the MoS totally irrelevant (hence point #1 is not a factor).

Now the next thing is that it's excluded for resisted abilities (point #2). And I get that. But there is one RAW way to eliminate the resistance roll - namely, that your target willingly chooses not to resist (for instance, for a beneficial Affliction), in which case it's not a Quick Contest and a resisted ability, but an ability that (by default) is based on Will. Is it legal (and if not, why shouldn't it be?) to have this Cosmic on the ability to remove the need to make your Will roll in these cases where it isn't being resisted?

I've always house-ruled it that way, because it seemed so completely devoid of abuse potential. But I'd like to know if it's technically GURPS legal, and again, if not, why not (pitfalls)?

And, as a related aside, let's say you did your Quick Contest - shouldn't this Cosmic be allowed on the ability such that a failed roll on your part becomes a minimum success (which may or may not still win you the Contest)?

[PK]

From GURPS Psionic Campaigns (p. 26):

Even resisted abilities may have this version of Cosmic. However, when using them, the psi must still roll against the controlling attribute (or skill) to determine his margin of success for the Quick Contest. If he fails the roll, the ability still works, but treat his margin of success as 0.

[jeff_wilson]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

From GURPS Psionic Campaigns (p. 26):

Even resisted abilities may have this version of Cosmic. However, when using them, the psi must still roll against the controlling attribute (or skill) to determine his margin of success for the Quick Contest. If he fails the roll, the ability still works, but treat his margin of success as 0.

So, the user can decline to roll and just go with zero if he wants, right? And then the Fixed Duration takes over? And without Fixed Duration, for wanted afflictions the victim can still roll to beat their Will and get that much duration?

[Not another shrubbery]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

So, the user can decline to roll and just go with zero if he wants, right? And then the Fixed Duration takes over?

It's still a Contest, meaning that whatever your MoS, the defender has the chance to tie or beat it.

[Kuroshima]

Originally Posted by Not another shrubbery

It's still a Contest, meaning that whatever your MoS, the defender has the chance to tie or beat it.

Unless you use the beneficial afflictions rule from powers, where the "victim" can decline to roll

[PK]

For a beneficial Affliction, the combination of Cosmic (NDRR) and Fixed Duration will accomplish the result of, "I use my ability and it buffs my friend for X minutes," yes.

But just to be clear, for a standard, hostile Affliction, the combination of the two means that if the attacker either fails his roll or declines to roll, his MOS is treated as 0, which means that the victim is very likely to defend successfully against it. If the victim still manages to fail, the ability afflicts him for a fixed duration of X minutes, regardless of the actual margin of victory.

[Kuroshima]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

For a beneficial Affliction, the combination of Cosmic (NDRR) and Fixed Duration will accomplish the result of, "I use my ability and it buffs my friend for X minutes," yes.

But just to be clear, for a standard, hostile Affliction, the combination of the two means that if the attacker either fails his roll or declines to roll, his MOS is treated as 0, which means that the victim is very likely to defend successfully against it. If the victim still manages to fail, the ability afflicts him for a fixed duration of X minutes, regardless of the actual margin of victory.

There is a way, but it's extremely expensive:
You need Malediction, bundled with Cosmic, no rule of 16, with enough will that on a 18, you, you still get 18 MoS, so anyone with an HT under 20 gets affected automatically

[NineDaysDead]

Originally Posted by Kuroshima

There is a way, but it's extremely expensive:
You need Malediction, bundled with Cosmic, no rule of 16, with enough will that on a 18, you, you still get 18 MoS, so anyone with an HT under 20 gets affected automatically

I don't think that works, if the attacker rolls 18, he failed, in which case he either didn't succeed or with Cosmic (NDRR) succeeded with a MOS of 0.

Cosmic: no rule of 16, means the rule of 16 doesn't apply, but that doesn't mean 17-18 aren't failures.

[jeff_wilson]

Originally Posted by NineDaysDead

I don't think that works, if the attacker rolls 18, he failed, in which case he either didn't succeed or with Cosmic (NDRR) succeeded with a MOS of 0.

Cosmic: no rule of 16, means the rule of 16 doesn't apply, but that doesn't mean 17-18 aren't failures.

It should depend on if it is an attack with resistance or a quick contest. Attacks fail on 17-18, but quick contests don't.

ETA: Well, crap. I can't find what's what now. There's supposed to be some circumstance where auto-fails don't apply but hanged if I can locate them.

[Not another shrubbery]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

But just to be clear, for a standard, hostile Affliction, the combination of the two means that if the attacker either fails his roll or declines to roll, his MOS is treated as 0, which means that the victim is very likely to defend successfully against it. If the victim still manages to fail, the ability afflicts him for a fixed duration of X minutes, regardless of the actual margin of victory.

Yeah. Of course, if the attacker has Cosmic: No Die Roll Required on his Affliction, he might as well roll, since he can't do worse than succeed by zero.

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

It should depend on if it is an attack with resistance or a quick contest. Attacks fail on 17-18, but quick contests don't.

ETA: Well, crap. I can't find what's what now. There's supposed to be some circumstance where auto-fails don't apply but hanged if I can locate them.

General Quick Contests don't have auto failure. Even if one of the participants fails his roll, he can still win the QC if the other fails by a larger margin. It's QC Resistance Rolls that make success imperative for the attacker.