Is there a reason why there is no table for submachine guns in GURPS Lite 4e?

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Frosty

After what all of the things you just mentioned, that actually sounds pretty close to impossible.

I've seen fully published, pricey hard-back RPGs that have less functionality than GURPS Lite. I suppose if you think submachine guns are vital, then yeah, I'd ask for my money back.

'course, it's free.

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by Mailanka

I've seen fully published, pricey hard-back RPGs that have less functionality than GURPS Lite. I suppose if you think submachine guns are vital, then yeah, I'd ask for my money back.

If a skill for submachine guns is included, then yes, I do think that a table of values for submachine guns is vital. That goes for everything else you mentioned, too.

If GURPS Lite Fourth Edition didn't make mention of skills without actually elaborating on rules of how to use them, then we wouldn't have this problem.

Originally Posted by Mailanka

'course, it's free.

I don't remember ever disputing that.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Frosty

If a skill for submachine guns is included, then yes, I do think that a table of values for submachine guns is vital. That goes for everything else you mentioned, too.

If GURPS Lite Fourth Edition didn't make mention of skills without actually elaborating on rules of how to use them, then we wouldn't have this problem.


I don't remember ever disputing that.

I'm not really sure what you expect out of GURPS Lite. It is, first and foremost, before anything else, a sampler for GURPS. It's a chance to see it in action and get a feel for how everything works. It tends to hit the highlights, gives you a good idea of what's available in the game, and provides sufficient functionality to play, but it's obviously a limited product. If you want more than what's provided in that book, then clearly, you should buckle down and buy the actual books.

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by Mailanka

I'm not really sure what you expect out of GURPS Lite.

I expect to be able to run a campaign in any setting, time period and genre.

Originally Posted by Mailanka

It is, first and foremost, before anything else, a sampler for GURPS.

I am aware of that and always have been.

Originally Posted by Mailanka

It's a chance to see it in action and get a feel for how everything works. It tends to hit the highlights, gives you a good idea of what's available in the game, and provides sufficient functionality to play, but it's obviously a limited product.

I can't see it in action if I find out that there is content my players can't use because they left out the rules and mechanics of how I'm supposed to mediate them.

Originally Posted by Mailanka

If you want more than what's provided in that book, then clearly, you should buckle down and buy the actual books.

I intended to buy some of the actual books like GURPS Basic Set, but not before actually running a test campaign.

It's like I'm trying to test-drive a new car with the intention of buying it (or related models), except that it's been stripped down to the bare basics and I only just find this out when I climb into the driver seat. All of the cool features and doo-hickeys advertised are there, they just don't actually work because someone went to the trouble of disabling them but still left them there.

So, basically, why are they still there?

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Frosty

After what all of the things you just mentioned, that actually sounds pretty close to impossible.

You can run a game with it, just not any game with it.

The shotgun too? Oh, man.

Again, no rules for Rapid Fire. The Shotgun's RoF statistic is basically meaningless in Lite.

Originally Posted by Frosty

If GURPS Lite Fourth Edition didn't make mention of skills without actually elaborating on rules of how to use them, then we wouldn't have this problem.

One thing Lite is useful for is as a quick reference for players who don't own the Basic Set, but are playing in a full GURPS game.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Frosty

I expect to be able to run a campaign in any setting, time period and genre.

With a free product?

I am aware of that and always have been.

I don't think you are, given the previous statement.

I can't see it in action if I find out that there is content my players can't use because they left out the rules and mechanics of how I'm supposed to mediate them.

Of course you can. GURPS Lite wouldn't be Lite if it contained every GURPS rule for you to "sample." But that doesn't mean you can't run a decent game with it. _A_ decent game, not _any_ decent game, as Sir Pudding points out.

It's like I'm trying to test-drive a new car with the intention of buying it (or related models), except that it's been stripped down to the bare basics and I only just find this out when I climb into the driver seat. All of the cool features and doo-hickeys advertised are there, they just don't actually work because someone went to the trouble of disabling them but still left them there.

It's more like playing a demo of a computer game.

[lachimba]

Originally Posted by Frosty

I
I intended to buy some of the actual books like GURPS Basic Set, but not before actually running a test campaign.

A test campaign?

I think running a test adventure (or playing in a test campaign) is a more modest goal and I think you could manage that.

[Lupo]

Originally Posted by Frosty

After what all of the things you just mentioned, that actually sounds pretty close to impossible.

I think it's very far-fetched to say that "running an adventure with GURPS Lite is impossible" just because there are no rules for Rapid fire.
You could fudge it, you know... saying that with a successful hit in full auto, you get hit by 1d6 bullets, or something...

It's quite obvious that a 32-page free booklet will be incomplete if compared to a 500 page book.

[gilbertocarlos]

I don't have a problem with that, if you want to be specific, don't take the lite version, simple.

If a player wanted a smg and I had only GURPS lite, I would say, take a rifle(for example), and use as if it was one, since a Lite game is made to be simple.

[copeab]

Originally Posted by gilbertocarlos

If a player wanted a smg and I had only GURPS lite, I would say, take a rifle(for example), and use as if it was one, since a Lite game is made to be simple.

One couldd use the automatic weapon and shotgun rules from 3e Lite for WWII, if you really wanted rules and didn't want to buy a nook. Sure, they aren't compatible with 4e but they're better than nothing.