metal shields

[dripton]

Basic has iron shields. Double weight and cost and HP, +3 DR.

Dungeon Fantasy calls them dwarven shields, and also adds +1 to their shield bash damage. Cumulative with +1 for a spike if you have one.

Martial Arts says that you can sharpen the edge of a metal shield and use it for swing-2 cutting damage.

So if you're using both DF and MA, and you sharpen the edge of a dwarven shield, does that swing-2 cutting damage get +1 for bashing with a dwarven shield? Or does only the traditional crushing kind of shield bash get +1 from a dwarven shield?

Also, if a metal shield has both a sharp edge and a spike, and you hit with the edge for cutting damage, do you get +1 for the spike? (I think the answer to this one is obvious, but I figured I'd ask it just for completeness.)

Thanks.

[Crakkerjakk]

Originally Posted by dripton

So if you're using both DF and MA, and you sharpen the edge of a dwarven shield, does that swing-2 cutting damage get +1 for bashing with a dwarven shield? Or does only the traditional crushing kind of shield bash get +1 from a dwarven shield?

I'd rule you could bash at sw-1 with the edge.

Originally Posted by dripton

Also, if a metal shield has both a sharp edge and a spike, and you hit with the edge for cutting damage, do you get +1 for the spike? (I think the answer to this one is obvious, but I figured I'd ask it just for completeness.)

No. You're correct, the answer is obvious. ;-)

[davidtmoore]

Originally Posted by Crakkerjakk

I'd rule you could bash at sw-1 with the edge.

I disagree. The +1 appears to arise from the fact that the shield's made of metal. The Martial Arts optional rule stipulates that this must be done with a metal shield. So just the Swing-2 for my vote.

[Crakkerjakk]

Originally Posted by davidtmoore

I disagree. The +1 appears to arise from the fact that the shield's made of metal. The Martial Arts optional rule stipulates that this must be done with a metal shield. So just the Swing-2 for my vote.

Ah, then I retract my earlier statement.

[Phantasm]

Originally Posted by dripton

Basic has iron shields. Double weight and cost and HP, +3 DR.

On a tangent, what effect does other metals have on shield? For example: Bronze, TL3/4 Steel, higher-quality TL5/6 Steel, or TL7+ Titanium Steel alloy?

This isn't counting the thick aluminum garbage can lid as an improvised buckler...

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by tbrock1031

On a tangent, what effect does other metals have on shield? For example: Bronze

Can't answer the rest, but bronze is like iron, but costs about 4 times as much (The ratio varies with period and region, like any other price, but Low Tech is suggesting a generic 4x).

Note that the weird Basic Set idea that bronze is softer somehow than iron (it isn't) is also corrected in Low Tech.

[mlangsdorf]

And Orichalcum is 1/3 the weight of bronze, so Orichalcum shields weigh 2/3rds as much as normal (x2 for metal, 1/3 for orichalcum).

[Rune]

Originally Posted by mlangsdorf

And Orichalcum is 1/3 the weight of bronze, so Orichalcum shields weigh 2/3rds as much as normal (x2 for metal, 1/3 for orichalcum).

OK - I am doing some thread hi-jacking here.
If Orichalcum weighs 1/3 of metal (for the same amount of protection), then it cannot suddenly weigh 2/3 because it is metal.

I know that DF1 says that Orichalcum shield weighs 2/3 of a normal shield.

But Orichalcum already weighs 1/3 of normal metal. So you cannot put in another *2 modifier in there.

I think you want that *2 modifier to come along because metal shields weigh twice as much as wood. But wood has never entered the equation here.
So following that logic Orichalcum shields should only weigh 1/3 of a normal metal shield.

Does anyone know (or can figure out) why an Orichalcum shield is so heavy? (Orichalcum armor follows the above mentioned rule of 1/3 weight but same DR).
It seems there is a breech in consistency there.
(Also, I believe this has been discussed before but I could not find the relevant thread)

[Diomedes]

Originally Posted by Rune

I think you want that *2 modifier to come along because metal shields weigh twice as much as wood. But wood has never entered the equation here.
So following that logic Orichalcum shields should only weigh 1/3 of a normal metal shield.

An orichalcum shield does weigh 1/3 as much as a normal metal shield, but the default shield is wood, not metal. Since metal shields are twice the weight, an orichalcum shield is 1/3 of that.

Does anyone know (or can figure out) why an Orichalcum shield is so heavy? (Orichalcum armor follows the above mentioned rule of 1/3 weight but same DR).

Orichalcum armor is for items that are already metal (really that are already bronze), so there's no need to double the weight for changing from wood to metal.

[mlangsdorf]

Originally Posted by Rune

OK - I am doing some thread hi-jacking here.
If Orichalcum weighs 1/3 of metal (for the same amount of protection), then it cannot suddenly weigh 2/3 because it is metal.

I know that DF1 says that Orichalcum shield weighs 2/3 of a normal shield.

But Orichalcum already weighs 1/3 of normal metal. So you cannot put in another *2 modifier in there.

Normal shields are wood. Metal shields weigh twice as much as wood shields. Orichalcum shields weigh 1/3 as much as metal shields.

Boring old algebraic properties say that orichalcum shields weigh 2/3rds as much as (normal) wood shields.