[Spaceships] Stealth Missiles?

Cernig · 08-11-2008, 09:00 PM

Does anyone want to hazard an educated guess at the SMs of standard caliber missiles?

I ask because I've a Space campaign in set-up where the TL10^ stuff I'm envisioning means a standard set of engagement ranges and turn length but highly propbale detection even of warships at ranges beyong extreme (most fall in the 0.1 AU range for "probable" detection, which will take about 1.5 hours to travel) and of "warp scars" left by ships emerging from warp-space detectable at ranges of 0.1 to 1AU depending on SM.

So, I want to steal an idea from Honor Harrington of having brillant missiles launched wayyyyy out, then coast until their final attack boost from normal engagement ranges...and stealth them to boot to make them even harder to detect.

Who needs a stealth "merchant raider" when you can use these babies? And in warship combat you time your salvo to arrive on target to disrupt the well-warned defenders just as your warships arrive in combat range.

But I need good info on missile SMs to scale the costs.

Regards, C

Ulzgoroth · 08-11-2008, 09:04 PM

Is something wrong with the gun and missile table on p47 for this?

Cernig · 08-12-2008, 12:02 AM

Well, damn my eyes! I missed the SM bit at the end of that table at least twice, even while looking for missile SM!

Ok, that lets me scale it. Thanks.

Next up - refreshing ECM so its actually useful. I'm considering a house rule that makes base ECM Level equal to the base Sensor Level for that SM and using quick contests of skill - basically, reinterpreting the system as a combined ECM/ECCM system - then using the "feint" rules as a bonus to an "ECM Dodge" (the attack is spoofed, can't lock on, whatever). A ship gets as many tries at a contest and a dodge as it has ECM systems, up to a maximum of three attacks/salvos.

That also lets me use decoy missiles, with an ECM system aboard (probably using a base skill of 11 for the robot 'brain") instead of a warhead, to degrade point defense.

Now - how about anti-radiation missiles and home-on-jam SEAD missiles designed to target sensors and ECM systems? We've got those at TL8.

Comments?

Regards, C

vicky_molokh · 08-12-2008, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cernig

Well, damn my eyes! I missed the SM bit at the end of that table at least twice, even while looking for missile SM!

Ok, that lets me scale it. Thanks.

Next up - refreshing ECM so its actually useful. I'm considering a house rule that makes base ECM Level equal to the base Sensor Level for that SM and using quick contests of skill - basically, reinterpreting the system as a combined ECM/ECCM system - then using the "feint" rules as a bonus to an "ECM Dodge" (the attack is spoofed, can't lock on, whatever). A ship gets as many tries at a contest and a dodge as it has ECM systems, up to a maximum of three attacks/salvos.

Take a look at some ideas here.

Edit: oh, nevermind. Let others look though.

Cernig · 08-12-2008, 01:10 AM

Hi Molokh,

That thread actually started me thinking about this, so thanks.

Another thought - in RL an ECM/ECCM system can aid allies who don't have one e.g. an EW aircraft flying as part of a strike to give ECM cover to the whole strike. I'm thinking about allowing ECM/ECCM to be extendable to other friendly vessels in the immediate area like this, but having it fall off with range (perhaps use the range modifiers for detection as a modifier to Skill). That brings up the prospect of a battlefleet or fighter squadron with a dedicated ECM/ECCM ship as one of it's primary units, so I might drop the 3 system maximum rule.

I'd note too that the idea of rating ECM systems like sensors brings up the possibility that a well-skilled operator with a big-ship system might win a Quick Contest against a less skilled user with a smaller but more high tech system. That seems about right to me.

I'm good on concept but not so hot on rules/number-crunching. I'm hoping some GURPS guru will pick this up and give me some good numbers to work with.

Regards, C

vicky_molokh · 08-12-2008, 04:02 AM

If I may ask, could you please thread topics to thread names? I know you're the OP, but it is much easier to follow the threadlist. It also makes searching the forum easier. Feel free to either create a new one (if you think the topic needs a fresh start), or post you ideas in mine (if you would like to continue the discussion of older ideas while also adding new ones).

BTW, look at how ECM works in EVE Online - some of my friends want me to join their team as an ECM-specialist character (but I won't).

08-11-2008, 09:00 PM	#1
Cernig Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Texas	[Spaceships] Stealth Missiles? Does anyone want to hazard an educated guess at the SMs of standard caliber missiles? I ask because I've a Space campaign in set-up where the TL10^ stuff I'm envisioning means a standard set of engagement ranges and turn length but highly propbale detection even of warships at ranges beyong extreme (most fall in the 0.1 AU range for "probable" detection, which will take about 1.5 hours to travel) and of "warp scars" left by ships emerging from warp-space detectable at ranges of 0.1 to 1AU depending on SM. So, I want to steal an idea from Honor Harrington of having brillant missiles launched wayyyyy out, then coast until their final attack boost from normal engagement ranges...and stealth them to boot to make them even harder to detect. Who needs a stealth "merchant raider" when you can use these babies? And in warship combat you time your salvo to arrive on target to disrupt the well-warned defenders just as your warships arrive in combat range. But I need good info on missile SMs to scale the costs. Regards, C

08-11-2008, 09:04 PM	#2
Ulzgoroth Join Date: Jul 2008	Re: [Spaceships] Stealth Missiles? Is something wrong with the gun and missile table on p47 for this?

08-12-2008, 12:02 AM	#3
Cernig Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Texas	Re: [Spaceships] Useful ECM Well, damn my eyes! I missed the SM bit at the end of that table at least twice, even while looking for missile SM! Ok, that lets me scale it. Thanks. Next up - refreshing ECM so its actually useful. I'm considering a house rule that makes base ECM Level equal to the base Sensor Level for that SM and using quick contests of skill - basically, reinterpreting the system as a combined ECM/ECCM system - then using the "feint" rules as a bonus to an "ECM Dodge" (the attack is spoofed, can't lock on, whatever). A ship gets as many tries at a contest and a dodge as it has ECM systems, up to a maximum of three attacks/salvos. That also lets me use decoy missiles, with an ECM system aboard (probably using a base skill of 11 for the robot 'brain") instead of a warhead, to degrade point defense. Now - how about anti-radiation missiles and home-on-jam SEAD missiles designed to target sensors and ECM systems? We've got those at TL8. Comments? Regards, C

08-12-2008, 01:10 AM	#5
Cernig Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Texas	Re: [Spaceships] Stealth Missiles? Hi Molokh, That thread actually started me thinking about this, so thanks. Another thought - in RL an ECM/ECCM system can aid allies who don't have one e.g. an EW aircraft flying as part of a strike to give ECM cover to the whole strike. I'm thinking about allowing ECM/ECCM to be extendable to other friendly vessels in the immediate area like this, but having it fall off with range (perhaps use the range modifiers for detection as a modifier to Skill). That brings up the prospect of a battlefleet or fighter squadron with a dedicated ECM/ECCM ship as one of it's primary units, so I might drop the 3 system maximum rule. I'd note too that the idea of rating ECM systems like sensors brings up the possibility that a well-skilled operator with a big-ship system might win a Quick Contest against a less skilled user with a smaller but more high tech system. That seems about right to me. I'm good on concept but not so hot on rules/number-crunching. I'm hoping some GURPS guru will pick this up and give me some good numbers to work with. Regards, C Last edited by Cernig; 08-12-2008 at 01:21 AM.

08-12-2008, 04:02 AM	#6
vicky_molokh GURPS FAQ Keeper Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Kyïv, Ukraine	Re: [Spaceships] Stealth Missiles? If I may ask, could you please thread topics to thread names? I know you're the OP, but it is much easier to follow the threadlist. It also makes searching the forum easier. Feel free to either create a new one (if you think the topic needs a fresh start), or post you ideas in mine (if you would like to continue the discussion of older ideas while also adding new ones). BTW, look at how ECM works in EVE Online - some of my friends want me to join their team as an ECM-specialist character (but I won't). __________________ Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper