Spell Power-ups

[TippetsTX]

From another thread (since I think this is worth a dedicated discussion)...

Originally Posted by Drakenbow

Tangent due to a comment: You mentioned for your house rules to waive certain thrown spell DX adjustments. There is for fighters an optional rule on p.127 "Waiting for an Opening" which I've been mulling around in my head for a similar version for wizards I would call "Taking Your Time". This would allow a wizard using the same constraints of not "moving, dodging, attacking, disbelieving, etc," for up to two turns to gain a DX bonus to casting.

For me, it's not only about extra time, but extra power. Overcoming the inherent range-based weakness of thrown spells requires an extra investment of ST in my game.

From my house-rules...
A wizard may use extra ST to increase the potency of their thrown spells. For each extra point expended, they can offset one increment of the range penalty for targets 1 or more hexes distant. For example, a wizard casting TRIP on an opponent 3 hexes away can choose to empower the spell with 2 extra points of ST (4 total) and reduce the range modifier to -1 DX. Boosting spells in this way does come with a drawback, however. Casting time is increased and the spell’s energy is not released until after all other actions in the turn have been resolved (much like the second arrow option for archers).

I'd like to hear more ideas for overcoming spellcasting penalties (usually DX) from the rest of you.

[TippetsTX]

Other types of spell-boosting rules are welcome here as well.

For example, what if extra ST into an illusion made it harder to disbelieve?

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

Other types of spell-boosting rules are welcome here as well.

For example, what if extra ST into an illusion made it harder to disbelieve?

I'd rather see ways to increase Creation range, whether that is through extra ST being required, a DX penalty, or both.

[Drakenbow]

Originally Posted by Shostak

I'd rather see ways to increase Creation range, whether that is through extra ST being required, a DX penalty, or both.

While types of spells are critical in considering how to handle, some already existing game mechanics could be used. Consider the Detect Life spell and the ability to increase the range at extra cost. The mechanics of the range is identical to Creation spells limitation of one mega-megahex.

Of course this would be a House Rule choice to allow it.

[phiwum]

I think Creation spells are useful enough. At least in my games, PCs choose them over Thrown spells more often than not.

Making Thrown spells more useful is, well, more useful.

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by phiwum

I think Creation spells are useful enough. At least in my games, PCs choose them over Thrown spells more often than not.

Summoning a 7-hex dragon using RAW Creation Spell range constraints (the entire figure has to be within the range) and the standard counter can be pretty challenging, making the spell a lot less useful than one might hope when selecting the spell for a character.

[Drakenbow]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

From another thread (since I think this is worth a dedicated discussion)...

From my house-rules...
A wizard may use extra ST to increase the potency of their thrown spells. For each extra point expended, they can offset one increment of the range penalty for targets 1 or more hexes distant. .... Casting time is increased and the spell’s energy is not released until after all other actions in the turn have been resolved (much like the second arrow option for archers).

That is an interesting concept of improving chances. For another RPG game, the my GM had a similar House Rule tool to use some hit points to shift from a miss to a hit. A question on the second part from playing with the House Rule, does the delay in release often make the spell's effect useless? If I had a high DX caster this could have a huge impact. If the caster has a low DX, it doesn't really change the order of events much.

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

Other types of spell-boosting rules are welcome here as well.

For example, what if extra ST into an illusion made it harder to disbelieve?

That is a good potential option. I rolled this around in my head a while but never came up with a good idea for implementing it. One thought though was if using the next higher Illusion spell but with an output of the lower level one. eg cast a 4-hex Illusion but the creation is just a 1-hex illusion. So it would require know 4-hex and using the same ST cost as 4-hex to make the 1-hex Illusion more powerful.

[Axly Suregrip]

I like Drakenbow's p.127 "Waiting for an Opening" with thrown spells. Thrown spells need something to make them a bigger part of the game. This does it and does it in a way that fit within the current rules by using the current rules. Perfect. I will be using this.

Regarding making illusions harder to disbelieve: neat idea but not one I will take up. Illusion is the most powerful for the cost spell that can be used too often. It does not need help to make it more useful.

Instead, I like my players having to make the call: if they see wizards or other smart foes, they can summon instead of illusion. Or they get creative with mixing illusions and summons. Otherwise illusions becomes used even more often.

[TippetsTX]

Originally Posted by Drakenbow

A question on the second part from playing with the House Rule, does the delay in release often make the spell's effect useless? If I had a high DX caster this could have a huge impact. If the caster has a low DX, it doesn't really change the order of events much.

In play (we've been using the rule for over two years), the impact isn't that drastic... inconvenient perhaps, but not useless. Yes, the high-DX wizard loses their chance to cast the spell before their lower-DX target can act, but that is simply a factor the player must consider before using this option. If the spell's effect is critical during that first turn, they will just take the penalty and cast it as normal. The game's heavy dependency on the ST stat also keeps this rule from being abused. That's been our experience, anyway.

[timm meyers]

This is indeed a great discussion/idea.

TippetsTX use of xtra ST cost to negate range modifiers is a fantastic and balanced house rule. However, it does border on and diminish the use of the aid spell which is in essence what the wizard is doing.

Increasing creation spell range (as suggested by shostak) is also a fun idea but I shudder at the potential of having fire hexes/myrmidons/giants being created at missile weapon like ranges (4MH? 5MH? 6MH!!!!). Obviously, the cost could be exponential to try and keep the attacking wizards from flaming the top of the city wall etc.
However, I have just decided that my next wizard is going to be a stone mage and his main spell will be "crush" ie summon stone walls 1MH (12'+) in the air that will "drop" on the target hex? Does that work? Need to look up the physics on that and maybe start a new thread LOL.

Back on topic.... I think these casting modifiers could be better balanced as new "Talents" for wizards (I know this idea has been proposed/discussed before).
examples
IQ 12 "Thrown Spell" (1) Gives +1DX modifier to all (T) spells. can be taken up to 3 times (just like Missile Weapons)
or
IQ 13 "Thrown Spells" (2) +2DX modifier for all (or just 1) thrown spells

IQ 14 "Creation Range" (2) add +1 MH to creation range of spells. May be taken a second time (total 4 IQ) for +2 MH range.

All in all I like the flavor and expanded tactical choice any of these methods bring to the table.