A question about setting wide power modifiers

[Kesendeja]

I was wondering about the cost of a disadvantage everyone in a setting had. If everyone has it would they get the points for it?

More precisely, I'm useing Sorcery, and in the setting anyone can learn magic, but all spells require a roll to cast (some need a second roll to aim is sometimes needed, I usually give the discount on these rolls).

I'm leery of double dipping, and universally applied power modifiers pose something of a problem. What would you do? Thanks

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

I was wondering about the cost of a disadvantage everyone in a setting had. If everyone has it would they get the points for it?

More precisely, I'm useing Sorcery, and in the setting anyone can learn magic, but all spells require a roll to cast (some need a second roll to aim is sometimes needed, I usually give the discount on these rolls).

I'm leery of double dipping, and universally applied power modifiers pose something of a problem. What would you do? Thanks

Have you thought about the people and creatures that just have the advantages that sorcery uses to build it's spells? Mind you there's no need to to include the limitation that is baked into every sorcery spell in the write up. That's just messy. Just adjust the price.

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

I was wondering about the cost of a disadvantage everyone in a setting had. If everyone has it would they get the points for it?

My inclination is to charge for anything that gets written on the character sheet.
You never know when characters are going to be transferred in from another universe, or some other situation that requires you to compare one batch of PCs to another who somehow lack the trait. Or allow a weird PC build that lacks it. In this particular case of spells, not every PC is going to have the same number of points worth of adjustment, and in the interest of fairness you really do need to keep track (consider what would happen if the spells came with so many modifiers as to be essentially worthless but you charged full value for them anyway - either nobody would take them or they'd definitely complain they were being cheated...)


You can after all simply adjust the campaign starting point total and/or disadvantage limit by whatever you need to offset anything truely universal, and achieve the same result as not including the trait in the point total without opening that (admittedly rather small) potential problem, so why not?

[Kesendeja]

Thanks for the feedback. I'll adjust the cost.

[Stormcrow]

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

More precisely, I'm useing Sorcery, and in the setting anyone can learn magic, but all spells require a roll to cast (some need a second roll to aim is sometimes needed, I usually give the discount on these rolls).

That sounds like a high-mana setting and customized rules for magic, not universal advantages or disadvantages.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

I was wondering about the cost of a disadvantage everyone in a setting had. If everyone has it would they get the points for it?

If *everyone* in the setting without any exception must adhere to a limitation it becomes a feature of the campaign. If any being/thing can avoid it then it's a limitation and avoiding it becomes an Unusual Background.

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

More precisely, I'm useing Sorcery, and in the setting anyone can learn magic, but all spells require a roll to cast (some need a second roll to aim is sometimes needed, I usually give the discount on these rolls).

I wouldn't roll it into a Power Modifier unless ALL spells require the same roll and all spells have no required roll to begin with. It gets messy otherwise.

[Kesendeja]

Originally Posted by Christopher R. Rice

If *everyone* in the setting without any exception must adhere to a limitation it becomes a feature of the campaign. If any being/thing can avoid it then it's a limitation and avoiding it becomes an Unusual Background.

I wouldn't roll it into a Power Modifier unless ALL spells require the same roll and all spells have no required roll to begin with. It gets messy otherwise.

The basic system only requires skill checks on spells that need to be aimed. The skill roll I want to know about would be added to all spells, it would representing the concentration it takes to shape the spell, and would be added in addition to the aim skill check on those spells.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

The basic system only requires skill checks on spells that need to be aimed. The skill roll I want to know about would be added to all spells, it would representing the concentration it takes to shape the spell, and would be added in addition to the aim skill check on those spells.

This is just an application of either Based on (Different Attribute) (p. B102), Requires (Attribute) Roll (GURPS Powers, p. 112), Requires Concentrate (GURPS Powers, p. 112), or Skills for Everyone (GURPS Powers,p. 162)

You need to check to see if it already required a roll to do something and then add appropriate modifiers. You'd need to also decide if spells that require an Innate Attack roll to hit require another roll to even work (which is what I think you are saying). If so, you'd need to modify it.

[Varyon]

Is this a case of everyone having Sorcery, but it always having some Limitation, or a case of only some characters having Sorcery, and the only form available is the one with said Limitation? In the former case, I wouldn't bother charging for Sorcery at all, nor accounting for the Limitation. In the latter case, the Sorcery Advantage is built functioning a certain way, and if your version of Sorcery isn't as powerful (that is, has Limitations), I feel it's more appropriate to charge fewer points for it. It's similar to Damage Reduction - in a campaign where you can only get it with the Tough Skin Limitation, I'd still have the -40% of Tough Skin apply, making it cost [3] per DR 1 rather than [5] per DR 1 (although I think After the End actually does charge a full [5] for DR 1 with Tough Skin, with it being the only form available to the player characters, so it can kinda go either way - it's all up to the GM/setting designer).

[Ulzgoroth]

While I wouldn't do it, one can 'zero out' an advantage or disadvantage that literally everyone in the setting has without too much disruption (it slightly messes with ally pricing).

However, that doesn't seem relevant to a limitation. You might have a limitation on all Sorcery abilities, but you don't have the same Limitation on skill ranks, basic character attributes, mundane advantages and disadvantages, and so forth. Do you? Thus the presence of the limitation does make a difference to character building. (It would anyway due to modifiers being additive rather than multiplicative.)

So just follow the rules. I'm not sure where double dipping would even be possible in this context.