Different Cosmics

[kirbwarrior]

A few ideas I've had on Cosmic;

Essential Fire (or any of them) can be made in Magic as Powers as just putting Cosmic +50% on Create (Powers recommends this, can't remember the page). But I still want Magical -10% on Create to signify it as a spell. Is this allowed? The intention is that it ignores mundane countermeasures (can't put it out with normal water) but not magical ones (Mana Damper would put it out).

Can you get Neutralize: Cosmic (and related traits, like Static)? I assume this would decrease Cosmic's power modifier by 5%.

I may be recalling this wrong, but I've always been uncomfortable with Cosmic the power modifier included in other Cosmics such as No Roll Required. I'm thinking of separating the two, so 'Cosmic' enhancements are just 'rules breaking' and having Cosmic being a power modifier (that then follows the rules of being cosmic). That way, I can put NRR on abilities without them being Cosmic. Would this distort points too much? Is this an unfair separation? On the specific note of Irresistible Attack, I would drop it's price to +250%, so it's value adds up to 300% with Cosmic (which sounds about right, since Cosmic on DR cancels it), add AD(100) +250% and AD(infinite) +300% to Armor Divisors (which Hardened can cancel), and rule that if you already have AD(infinite), adding Cosmic +50% is enough to make it also Irresistible.

Would Cosmic +50% do anything when added to an attribute? I know power modifiers do affect them (Magical on ST makes it go away in no mana zones, for instance). I can't think of much other than Afflictions can't decrease them.

How would one deal with 'levels' of Cosmic? Powers does detail how to apply them to power modifiers, but that doesn't work when the setting asks for a Cosmic above Cosmic (which beats wild powers). I know it's weird and might sometimes be thought of as corny, but when you are dealing with significantly different levels of gods, it comes up (one campaign the players had ended up becoming actual gods, but already knew some gods couldn't at all compete with higher gods, even though on the mortal plane cosmic powers where cosmic).

I know you can apply power modifiers to perks (Ignition could be magical as to represent Ignite Fire). Can you do this with Cosmic? Can you apply certain cosmics to perks (such as NRR and Irresistible)? I know you can't normally apply modifiers to perks, but NRR sounds really useful on Controllable Disadvantage, and not at all unbalancing (especially considering that No Nuisance Rolls is also a perk, and would amount to about the same thing).

Thanks ahead of time.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

A few ideas I've had on Cosmic;

Essential Fire (or any of them) can be made in Magic as Powers as just putting Cosmic +50% on Create (Powers recommends this, can't remember the page). But I still want Magical -10% on Create to signify it as a spell. Is this allowed? The intention is that it ignores mundane countermeasures (can't put it out with normal water) but not magical ones (Mana Damper would put it out).

Ahem. Don't confuse the power source with the advantage modifier. The Cosmic power source is so-called because it comes with an automatic Cosmic advantage modifier but you need not take a Cosmic power source to have the modifier.

Note, however that if you just don't take the extra -10% for being "Fire Magic" rather than just generic "Magic" then you end up with a magic thing that may look and feel like fire, but isn't, and is not vulnerable to non-magical water.

I may be recalling this wrong, but I've always been uncomfortable with Cosmic the power modifier included in other Cosmics such as No Roll Required.

That's because it isn't.

Would Cosmic +50% do anything when added to an attribute?

Not much since Attributes don't have limitations to take away.

I know you can apply power modifiers to perks (Ignition could be magical as to represent Ignite Fire). Can you do this with Cosmic? Can you apply certain cosmics to perks (such as NRR and Irresistible)? I know you can't normally apply modifiers to perks, but NRR sounds really useful on Controllable Disadvantage,

I would suggest getting a second perk to modify the first.

[Agemegos]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

Ahem. Don't confuse the power source with the advantage modifier.

Hear! Hear! It's perhaps unfortunate that "Cosmic" is used for both; they are clearly and importantly different.

[kirbwarrior]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

That's because it isn't.

Oh. I swear it's been pointed out to me a few times that it was. But the fact it applies in reverse still bothers me for the same reasons.

EDIT: On the note of Create, I meant to use Create Fire (Cosmic +50%, Magical -10%) in my example.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

Oh. I swear it's been pointed out to me a few times that it was. But the fact it applies in reverse still bothers me for the same reasons.

I don't understand. How is it a problem that a power with a Cosmic power modifier can't be suppressed by any power that doesn't have a Cosmic power modifier?

EDIT: On the note of Create, I meant to use Create Fire (Cosmic +50%, Magical -10%) in my example.

And what's the Cosmic for?

[gjc8]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

And what's the Cosmic for?

To Create fire that matches (some of) the characteristics of Essential Fire from Magic using Powers. Not being extinguishable with (non-Cosmic) water, for example.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by gjc8

To Create fire that matches (some of) the characteristics of Essential Fire from Magic using Powers. Not being extinguishable with (non-Cosmic) water, for example.

It would be simpler just to create an area effect continuing burning attack.

[kirbwarrior]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

I don't understand. How is it a problem that a power with a Cosmic power modifier can't be suppressed by any power that doesn't have a Cosmic power modifier?

The Cosmic power power modifier sounds like it is worth 50% alone, not counting things like rules-breaking, No Roll Required, and so on. More importantly, what's the difference between these two abilities;

Detect Gold (Cosmic: No Roll required +100%)

Detect Gold (Cosmic: No Roll required +100%) + Cosmic Talent 1

To me, all I want out of the first one is knowledge that I don't have to roll to use the ability, and that I know my exact distance with it. But, somehow, adding Cosmic Talent now makes the ability also ignore mundane countermeasures and work wherever I go?

[gjc8]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

To me, all I want out of the first one is knowledge that I don't have to roll to use the ability, and that I know my exact distance with it. But, somehow, adding Cosmic Talent now makes the ability also ignore mundane countermeasures and work wherever I go?

The first one already has no mundane countermeasures and works wherever you go. If it doesn't you get a power modifier limitation.

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

The Cosmic power power modifier sounds like it is worth 50% alone, not counting things like rules-breaking, No Roll Required, and so on. More importantly, what's the difference between these two abilities;

Detect Gold (Cosmic: No Roll required +100%)

Detect Gold (Cosmic: No Roll required +100%) + Cosmic Talent 1

To me, all I want out of the first one is knowledge that I don't have to roll to use the ability, and that I know my exact distance with it. But, somehow, adding Cosmic Talent now makes the ability also ignore mundane countermeasures and work wherever I go?

If it's part of a Cosmic Power, you should distinguish it.

Detect Gold (Cosmic PM, +50%; Cosmic: No Roll required +50%)

Powers with a Cosmic PM pay 15 points per level for Talent, which does help level the advantage a touch. But you're right, the Cosmic PM has a great feature! I know I talked about it in a thread once when I said "I found the free lunch!" regarding Cosmic as a PM.