View Single Post
Old 09-25-2019, 03:44 PM   #55
Polydamas
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Central Europe
Default Re: [Low-Tech] Padded Cloth and Layered Armour penalty

So I was wrong about the weight of Padded Cloth in GURPS Low Tech, I remembered 4 lbs for the Torso + Groin. Realistically it might be fair to give most low-tech armour 4 pounds for DR 1 on the torso, but in Dungeon Fantasy type settings you want a way to distinguish between many styles of armour, and Dan wanted a type of armour to represent the padded armour in the Basic Set.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasna View Post
The point is that some padding that will be DR 1* in game was sometimes worn, especially if you consider the Charles garment as Light Layered Cloth with DR 2*. Both the kabadion and some aketons from mid XII century to early XIV century were thicker than ordinary clothing, enough to give DR 1* (even if they didn't reach the GURPS's "6 lbs. for 100% of torso armour"). Treating them as Padded Cloth (removing the need of separate Ordinary Clothing garments, and thus considering them as being 4.4 lbs. + 1.6 lbs. of Ordinary Clothing; or even better, as 3.5 lbs. + 1.6 lbs of Ordinary Clothing in case of Expert Tailoring) would be fine IMO, and this specific combination shouldn't give DX penalty (maybe adding +1 CF for being made and tailored to worn with other forms of armour for a better game balance).
I think it is fair for iron armour + DR 1* linen armour to give -1 DX. Realistically this combination is hot and bulky, but since GURPS does not represent either a DX penalty is fair (alternatively, enforce an extra -1 FP after fights as if wearing winter clothing, page B426). The anonymous Byzantine on strategy actually says that many soldiers don't want to wear thick quilted garments under their armour, but they should because ... Many of the other sources are explicit that the quilted garment is worn over the iron mail.

We have two quilted garments from France in the 1200s: one is a quilted coat for a queen, the other is a sleeve for a soldier. Both are made in the same way, with unspun cotton quilted between layers of cloth. Ordinary European clothing from 1300 to 1600 probably has DR 1 (cut) on Torso, Arms, and sometimes Neck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasna View Post
At sight, it could be GURPS "Padded Cloth", GURPS "Light Layered Cloth" or a real-life in-between these two (something that maybe would give DR 1.5*, but we have to round up or down both DR and weight for game granularity). I'll treat it as "Padded Cloth" or, at maximum, as "Light Layered Cloth" for torso and shoulders and "Padded Cloth" for the rest of the sleeves. Anyway, is clearly something heavier than regular clothing but lighter than a proper jack meant to be used as standalone armour, and is worn between mail and breastplate.
Yes, it is hard with just the painting. And so is deciding when to assess a penalty for wearing multiple layers of armour, but in a game, where you usually don't represent that the padded armour is DR 3 on the back but DR 1 in the area covered by the breastplate, it is fair to be strict. GMs who have worn armour can adjust the rules on a case-by-case basis. I would probably be generous to someone who wanted to wear just a Breastplate (Chest Front) over a specially made Layered Cloth garment, and harsh to someone who obviously just wanted the most DR for the least GURPS Dollars.
__________________
"It is easier to banish a habit of thought than a piece of knowledge." H. Beam Piper
Polydamas is offline   Reply With Quote