Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony
In general the layered armor penalty is for two armor layers both designed to work independently as armor, not for two armor layers that are designed to work together -- it's just that two armor layers that are designed to work together tends to be statted up as a single suit of armor with multiple components, not as two suits of armor.
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Usually yes, this is the case, but is possible to use Padded Cloth alone and in combination with something heavier, because it's at the same time a form of padding and a form of armour. GURPS rules penalise the conjuct use of proper armour with DR 1+ padding.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon
Outer armor can probably be tailored to assume an inner layer of a given thickness (this is basically the same as armor tailored for a larger individual), and wearing this without the expected inner layer would result in a DX penalty, while wearing it with would mean no penalty. There’s a limit to how thick armor can be before it physically gets in the way of movements, however - I generally assume up to 0.2” for rigid and up to 0.5” for flexible is ok (for hybrid cases, no more than 0.2” for the rigid layer and no more than 0.5” overall). Some areas (Chest, Skull) can be thicker, some areas (joints, mostly) must be thinner, of course, but that level of detail isn’t strictly necessary. That’s for a human with an average build; larger characters can wear thicker armor, smaller characters must wear thinner armor.
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Padded Cloth is flexible and is 0.25" thick. That's why I think that the DX penalty is excessive, if the armour "layered" with Padded Cloth isn't of Cheap Quality. So I'm for decreasing the penalty from a milder form (ex. -1 only to some DX-based skills, like Fast-Draw) to no penalties at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanHoward
Any armour worn over what Low-Tech defines as "Padded Cloth" definitely requires a DX penalty.
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I don't agree with you, Dan, at least not in game terms. Of course the point of the discussion is to take something that is real and "translate" it in GURPS stats. We can translate most historical pourpoints as being DR 0, but not the thickest of them (DR 1* to DR 2*) that were still used with some other form of armour.
GURPS DR 1* "Padded Cloth" is described as being only 1/4" (ca 0,625 cm) thick, so can be translated in something that could be 6-8 layers thick. Which was rarely worn by itself, but it can provides some protection against punches, batons, sword cuts and knife stabs, while the normal underpadding (DR 0) when alone has no protective value at all, at least in GURPS terms. So we are talking about a thick vest or a thicker-than-usual form of padding, depending on cases.
Textile standalone armour would be anything from Light Layered Cloth (DR 2*) to Proofed Paper (DR 6). The combination of a thicker-than-usual padded garment worn with mail and/or lamellar or plate armour translated in GURPS game dynamics is present in your own work, Dan: Qin Cavalry Loadout, Byzantine Skoutatos Loadout, Third Crusade European Loadout, Mamluk Heavy Cavalry Loadout and Northern Mughal Cavalry Loadout, all of them wear metallic armour over GURPS Padded Cloth.