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Old 12-03-2020, 06:46 AM   #12
Join Date: Jul 2015
Default Re: Arm Lock with and without Technical Grappling rules

Originally Posted by DouglasCole View Post

That is a "weight advantage" from TG.
I probably should have been more clear, but I'm talking about standing grappling, and using locks to force a standing opponent to turn his kicking leg into his load bearing leg. You can't kick with a leg that is bearing more than 50% of your body weight. Again, that may be below the resolution of GURPS rules, but is a key component to not getting kicked while in a standing grapple. I've learned this the hard way as a handful of the people I train with have TKD backgrounds and will kick the living **** out of you instinctively, even when you have them in a standing joint lock, if you don't force their body weight over whichever leg it makes the most sense for them to kick you with.

Originally Posted by DouglasCole
Hands-free parries are part of both TG and MA, and an important part of leveraging the CP from an arm lock. So is exploiting relative position - this is given a drive-by mention on p. 18.
They are, but TG makes it pretty explicit that you can't use Hands Free parries against strikes...only against grapple attacks.

Originally Posted by Technical Grappling, PG 22
If an opponent attacks you with a grappling move (not a strike) against which you would be permitted a parry, you may parry using any unarmed combat skill and specify that this defense is a “technical parry” or a “counter”:
Again, in my experience, at least when a joint lock is involved, you can totally use the locked limb to short-circuit striking attempts by your foe. It hasn't come up in the games I run, but if it did, I would allow a hands-free Judo/Wrestling/Sumo parry if you have a foe in a joint lock. If it's just a simple grapple, that might be a harder sell, though.

Originally Posted by DouglasCole
* You are attacking, and so can and should leverage change position to slide into the side arc (rear if you can). If this is successful, they defend against your lock at a further -2. Attacking into your side arc (for the bad guy) is at -5 AND skill is capped at 9: it's considered a Wild Swing. So you're at -5 to DX to punch, -7 to DX to kick, and both skills are capped at 9. You can also spend CP to reduce his skill roll even further, or boost your own defenses.
THAT is what I was missing. I was getting the penalty for defending attacks from the side/rear arc, but totally forgot about the -5 wild swing/skill cap 9! That's the missing piece! Not sure at all how I missed that, especially since I've been using relative facing and changing posture/position during a step from the beginning. Thanks for the refresher.

Originally Posted by DouglasCole
Overall, if the sequence for a prospective joint lock is "I grabbing parry, stay in front of my foe, arm lock, still stay in front of my foe, wait for his attack, arm lock again STILL staying in front of my foe, etc." then the fighter is not exploiting all of their options.

The key one to not getting biffed by the other guy is achieving the side arc. This is - perhaps usefully - subsumed into many things in non-TG GURPS, but it's available, and really important to avoid the kind of counter attack you're describing. Making your foe's attacks at -5/Wild Swing is a big deal.
That was certainly it. Thanks for the rule reminder. It really was the missing piece for me.
EskrimadorNC is offline   Reply With Quote