Quote:
Originally Posted by maximara
Did the pre-Religion way of Clerical magic exist in GURPS Fantasy 1st edition as it did in Classic: Magic? If so by a strict RAW it was Magery 0 in all but name. It would go a long way on explaining why the Errata for GURPS Fantasy 1st edition is written the way the way it is.
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The only reference to clerical magic in GURPS FANTASY 1st edition was "How Religion Works" sidebar on page 70. It lists the possibilities as:
Non-intervention
Occasional intervention
Magical Aid
Active Deities
The Magical aid simply states that magic is a divine power. It, like GURPS MAGIC page 84, or GURPS MAGIC 2nd edition page 94, suggests granting a bonus of +1 to +3 depending on the deity and the college of spells etc.
Unlike GURPS MAGIC or GURPS MAGIC 2nd edition, where we have perhaps the first recorded instance of magery 0 (ie, Clerical investment for spell casting is made more expensive per college of spells, but also an additional +5 cost per +1 bonus to spell casting) - GURPS FANTASY 1st edition doesn't go that far with Clerical Investment at all. Looking at GURPS 2nd edition, Clerical Investment was not even invented as an advantage yet. GURPS 2nd edition books I have in my possession show a copyright of 1986.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maximara
"A simple clerical advantage is to allow non-mage clerics to use spells of one (or a few) colleges as though they were mages. So, even in normal and low-mana areas, a cleric of (for instance) a healing-oriented power can cast Healing spells."
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But - as best as I can tell, even with GURPS MAGIC or GURPS MAGIC 2nd edition, such "Miracle casting" was still subject to the penalties of low mana. Only later did GURPS draw away from Mana for clerical powers by calling it sanctity or some such.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maximara
IIRC they only exist in Pyramid 3/76: Dungeon Fantasy IV. (2015) meaning they are a very late comer to 4e and aimed at Dungeon Fantasy which is not Yrth.
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I could grow to hate you for pointing out yet another Pyramid issue I don't have. LOL
<snipped stuff>
Quote:
Originally Posted by maximara
Well that "framework" includes non-magery/non-Power Investiture Clerical magic, Rune Magic, and Alchemy so there is still a lot on the table.
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The good news is - that absent any specifics in "Rune Magic" and Clerical powers etc - we can either do one of two things:
Merge in with the original 2% population figure, EVERY style of magic that can be cast, which includes Runemagic, knacks, clerical magics etc - or we can make the presumption that the original 2% was geared for specifically, the spell slingers from GURPS FANTASY 1st edition, and for those who still want to use that 2% guideline - everything that GURPS MAGIC introduced subsequently.
As was discovered in the other thread (Mages are coins) - I did a test run of code I created for use with VB.NET that would essentially use the full 2% value of a general population as an "entered manually" bit of data. It would then spit out what the magery values were based on each lower level of magery was 10x more common than the next highest. I did 5 test runs for each version (magery 1-3 only and the newer magery 0 to 3) and found an interesting pattern emerge...
Here is a sample of five runs that generate the Magery using non-magery 0:
Magery 1: 44 Magery 2: 7 Magery3: 0
Magery 1: 42 Magery 2: 9 Magery3: 0
Magery 1: 44 Magery 2: 6 Magery3: 1
Magery 1: 41 Magery 2: 9 Magery3: 1
Magery 1: 46 Magery 2: 5 Magery3: 0
This is what I generate when allowing for the new fangled Magery 0 instead:
Magery 0: 47 Magery 1: 4 Magery 2: 0 Magery3: 0
Magery 0: 44 Magery 1: 7 Magery 2: 0 Magery3: 0
Magery 0: 47 Magery 1: 4 Magery 2: 0 Magery3: 0
Magery 0: 41 Magery 1: 9 Magery 2: 1 Magery3: 0
Magery 0: 41 Magery 1: 10 Magery 2: 0 Magery3: 0
Note that in those runs, I was basically rolling a random number between 1 to 111 for the more traditional pre-magery 0 table of results, and from 1 to 1111 for the Magery 0 to magery 3 results. The idea was that each person born with Magery, would get a randomly generated Magery value that was in line with statistical expectations.
Magery 0 as part of a 2% population limit, results in 90% of all mageborn having only magery 0. The pre-magery 0 method results in 90% of the mageborn population having Magery 1 instead. So that is a relatively huge difference right there.
In the end? The prevelance of magery within a population is strictly a world building decision. If you make this a genetic issue, assuming that Magery is a recessive gene, then to obtain a roughly 2% population with a purely recessive gene sequence, you would have to have Magery depend on 6 genetic factors. The value would be 1/2^6 which is 1.5% of the population.
If on the other hand, you wanted to go with Magery 3 depends on a purely recessive gene set up for 10 sites, the odds of having a pure Magery 3 type of individual would be 1/2^10 or .097 percent of the general population. You could then monkey around with the idea of saying that variations in sites 7 through 10 determine various effects such as Magery 0, Magery 1, Magery 2 and even one college magery etc. But that is a detail that I really don't want to get into. If you really wanted to be nasty, one could easily make it that Genetically speaking, to have a pure magery 3 character, the magery genes are also linked with genetic disorders that MUST be present for it to express itself (ie become functional). Frankly? Genetics make me want to run and forget numbers at all... Statistical analysis is NOT my forte. I'm fine up to pre-calculus. ;)