[FeiLin]

Originally Posted by Plane

Something like that probably makes sense for cars/trucks now that I think about it...

I guess if wheels are extremities/feet then it must be the axles which are the limbs/legs? It's actually hard to think of what "death" actually means in this case... would a car's radio possible cease to work because if an axle breaking?

Heh, interesting example. I guess a "dead" car is one which has broken down to the point it no longer starts (or at least move), but has the perk "equipment works until battery's run out" (which most vehicles would have)?

Originally Posted by Plane

B421 doesn't mention that the destruction/dismemberment of a limb can surpass the usual cap of damage (like 6 HP for a crippled limb in example)

Having those be more life-threatening would be covered by using MA138's "Severe Bleeding" rules which gives extra penalties to the bleeding rules for destroyed limbs/extremities, with an extra penalty if the destruction was dismemberment-by-cutting. The -3/-4 for limbs is identical to targeting veins/arteries on that limb.

Veins/Arteries might somehow be worse (inexplicably) though because unlike dismemberment there's no mention of it reverting to normal bleeding rules once HP lost to blood loss equals amount needed to cripple.

That's what I gathered; the dismemberment of a limb wont inflict more than a crippling. I found on B421 that it says: "If injury to a body part before applying the above limit was at least twice what was needed to cripple it, the body part is not just crippled but destroyed" (so that answers my own question).

One thing that perplexes me about limb loss and crippling (or even any damage), is that while there are some effects in 20 seconds, beyond shock the next second, I wont feel anything. Now, IRL, I've never lost a limb/extremity, but quite a few borderline cripplings, but whenever I've taken damage, I've felt what I would assume is the equivalent of Pain/Agony. How come there's no pain connected to losing/crippling a limb (or even just taking damage)? I could perhaps see if you remain still and rest, the effects would be delayed, but the exertion of combat, are you really in shape to hit back?

Suppose 10 HP, the arm is crippled at 6. The very next round there's some shock, but bleeding is per 30 seconds, and with 4 HP, what's there to stop me from using my other arm to attack for another 20 odd seconds? Shouldn't a crippling be Moderate/Severe Pain and a lost limb be Terrible Pain/Agony, or something along those lines? I mean, I get there's adrenaline pumping, but is it really that strong? (I have no idea.)

On the other hand, sure, I could see that it's waaay more gameable that way. Otherwise, it's basically "every combat first to 1 hit", almost regardless of HP and other factors, and that might not be realistic either (or at least not fun).

Originally Posted by Plane

That's an interesting observation... MA136's parenthesis does indeed say "the usual penalty for having less than 1/3 your HP remaining)."

If that's no longer instantaneous (delayed for seconds) then that WOULD be a major rules shift...

My speculation is that the highest tier of injury on all parts is meant to be instantaneous. You can "ignore the effects of a non-crippling injury for... " but we can see for limbs (arm/leg) that the charts' final entry is "injury over HP/2" with "cripples the leg".

Injury over 2/3 might be meant like that (akin to "cripples the torso") where the -3 to DX (unlike the -1 or -2) is meant to be instant.

Definitely. I could even see all levels as instantaneous, tbh, or at least that the adrenaline last shorter time (HT or HT/2 s?).

Originally Posted by Plane

I'd like to see HP induce things at 20% or 10% increments

Yeah, that would make sense, and I'd be open to that. Perhaps that's too narrow increments to be meaningful or distinguishable? Damage is pretty random as is. Most average ST characters roll 1d and add something, which might mean 1d+1 may be 2 or it may be 7, with equal probability. Narrow increments would rather embrace that randomness by hooking up penalties to those rolls (especially the first blow).