Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

The templates in Fantasy - not Dungeon Fantasy, but the older hardcover - run 75 to 125 points. Mind, these templates tend to assume "human", and don't work well with high-point racial templates. The one game I ran with it, ages ago, seemed to work pretty well. The only template I didn't use was Fantasy's "True King".

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

In GURPS (and many other point-based systems), a character started at x points and advanced through play will not look the same as if the character had been started on y points. There are two reasons for this:

(1): As Peter noted, some advantages that are easily affordable at y points are not at x points. Further, some GMs may not feel comfortable allowing some advantages to be bought in plsy, restricting thrm to starting characters.

(2): A character on y points may start play with a week of development, while a character grown to y points may be developed over a year or more. This will have a noticable effect on what abilities the character had.

My personal preference as a GM is to go x to y, rather than starting at y, using generous CP awards (3-7) per session.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

I've had good results recently with a DF-esque game that started at 150+25+5. The PCs are now ~250 pts, and everyone seems to have had a pretty good time getting there.

I think a larger party has an easier time with lower starting points, we had 3 players each running 2 PCs. I would advocate at least 4-5 PCs. This allows for more specialization, and helps prevent TPK if someone falls down. If you're not running multiple PCs per player, then it's probably smart to have an NPC (with character sheet) you can hand off to any player whose PC dies, as a temporary replacement so they have something to do.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

Kromm has said somewhere, sometime, that the reason he chose 250 points because he wanted martial artists and they weren't really competitive before that. So beware, they may have trouble keeping up at 125 points.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

Notable is that DF 15 doesn't have a 125 point Martial Artist template. It has a +125 point lens you can put on a 125 template that would make a 250 point martial-artsy character, but that's clearly different.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

THis is good advice. I generally have group sizes around 2 - 4 players (when it gets to 2 I start recruiting, when it gets to 4 I stop). In any DF or even "adventure" focused game (i.e., one with a large combat component), I end up putting in a few NPCs. In combat, I often hand out the NPCs to be controlled by the players. If a PC dies, they get to play one of the NPCs until they can create a new character and that character can be integrated into the party. However, I've had players decide to just keep on playing the NPCs, which has been quite successful in the past.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

It's a good idea for smaller groups (or even solo players). It's a very old-school approach - filling in the ranks with hirelings and henchmen goes back to the early 70s at least. And it's exactly what the 125-point templates and 62-point templates in DF15 are for. The 125s are the reliable henchmen - good but not as good, useful but a bit more narrowly useful. The 62s are the makeweights and extras - carrying capacity, light sourcing, and back-rank fighting.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

I appreciate that some character "classes" may not be as competative at lower point values.

However, it is still more fun to have the option of playing those "classes" at lower levels than not to have that option.

Back in the old AD&D games, a starting martial artist (monk) was useless, but it didn't stop us wanting to play one because of the cool thinks the monk could do later on.

Personally, I would love to play a 125 point martial artist in a party of 125 DF characters, especially with the prospect of working my way up to 250 points.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

And that's perfectly fine as long as you know that. But a new player might be disappointed because he's lagging behind in power.

The link I gave has templates for 100-, 150-, and 200- point DF characters. Pick the 100-point one and give then 25 points to spend on anything on the template.

Re: [DF] 125 pt start?
 

From my (admittedly limited) experience with D&D, it always looked to me like monks did improve with experience, but remained largely inferior to more traditional fighters. Yes, they could get bonuses on unarmed attacks that makes them more than a match for an ordinary armed mook, but by that time the fighters are traditionally getting better bonuses from magic weapons.