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-   -   [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions (https://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=92738)

Mulsiphix 06-15-2012 12:30 PM

[GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
I have finally done it. I finished GURPS Lite, am planning to play my first game ever, I only have one player (my wife), but was hoping to do this on Father's Day. My wife prefers the Fantasy genre but I will most likely be running our first campaign in a fantasy setting so I am open to other ideas for our first foray into GURPS. I was hoping you fine folks could offer up some suggestions or even ideas on what I should try my hand at first? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Raekai 06-15-2012 12:53 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Well, I guess it depends really. Right now I'm working on building up some campaigns myself. The thing is that you are very limited with just GURPS Lite. So I would recommend with sticking to fantasy. Create some standard good guys and bad guys and just create a small quest. There are lots of resources available to you (again, they're a little hard to use without more books). This is a good resource for monsters. I'd make it some small quest. You're going after a legendary sword that will give you +1d6 fire damage when you use it. Now, I won't suggest getting more books though because GURPS isn't for all people. One of my good friends finds GURPS boring. I would say:

1. Go over character creation.
2. You both make a character.
3. Set up a few good guys.
4. Set up a few bad guys.
5. Find a small map for adventuring. Good example.
6. Don't worry about fleshing everything out.
7. Set up a goal.
8. Play!

vicky_molokh 06-15-2012 12:57 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Your first campaign as in, first campaign together and first campaign you run, but your wife played TT RPGs before
- or -
first game ever for each one of you?

jacobmuller 06-15-2012 12:59 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Caravan to Ein Arris is free and a nice starter.

There might be a missing map (I have it somewhere, from 2nd edition) but it's just a hut, with a gate in front to block the road, being used as a customs duty collection point.

Mulsiphix 06-15-2012 01:14 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh (Post 1393897)
Your first campaign as in, first campaign together and first campaign you run, but your wife played TT RPGs before
- or -
first game ever for each one of you?

I played a newbie-friendly game of D&D 3.5E for about six sessions about five years ago. I've done some play by post, no rules/story only roleplaying, browsed more than my fair share of p&p games and read hundreds of reviews for various systems and supplements. This will be my wife's first time playing, my first time GM'ing, and my first time playing with GURPS. I said "first time" as my past experience probably isn't going to be very helpful to me. Kind of a "clean slate" situation =).

jacobmuller 06-15-2012 01:29 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Don't worry too much about the rules - you'll get something wrong but the important thing is having fun.
You'll know your wife's personality - play the game the way that suits her.
First games tend to be about slapstick comedy and mayhem.

Jeffr0 06-15-2012 01:39 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
My advice is to play and then keep on playing.

Play with little kids. Play solitaire. Set up a short play-by-forum game. Something. Anything!

If you're short on time, break things down into several mini-sessions of 15 to 30 minutes. Don't try to learn all the rules at once. Sit down to a session with a goal of using one particular thing... and then... between sessions think through how you could have done it better and whether or not doing it "right" would have added to the fun. (Sometimes the answer is "yes." Usually you can get away with bending or ignoring rules.)

Sometimes months can go by and you wonder why you haven't played. What I've noticed is... if I am ready to go at the drop of a hat, somehow I see that I have so many more gaming opportunities than I thought I had. And even if I can play exactly what I want to play, playing anything makes it easier to take advantage of opportunities when things do go my way.

whswhs 06-15-2012 01:45 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
I'm fond of fantasy, but the magic rules are a bit much for a first time, and you don't really have any spells in GURPS Lite anyway. It would be like doing a supers campaign with no rules for powers.

That's not to say you couldn't run a game in a fantasy milieu, where the "magic" was special abilities of Enemies or Patrons, without detailed game mechanics, and the player character(s) had to solve the problem or defeat the threat without magic. But you could run the same sort of game in a historical milieu such as French swashbuckling or Old West, or a present-day spy or police procedural, or even a science fictional world.

The first rule of good design for campaigns, settings, and scenarios is consider your audience. What sort of character activities will your player think are cool? Swordplay, gunfights, fisticuffs, sneaking and stealing, social intrigue, witty dialogue? Is there a setting she especially likes?

You might try sketching out two or three options, a couple of sentences each, and see if one of them grabs her. That's what I do with my player pool, in a more formalized way.

Bill Stoddard

Mulsiphix 06-16-2012 09:31 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
I know Temple of the Lost Gods is for 3E but how hard would it be to convert to 4E and adapt to a 1 or 2 player game (she could play two PC's). I also came across Lands Out of Time and the one-shot Lair of the Fat Man. I don't own either of these so I was hoping somebody who is familiar could give me their thoughts.

vicky_molokh 06-16-2012 09:43 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394325)
I know Temple of the Lost Gods is for 3E but how hard would it be to convert to 4E and adapt to a 1 or 2 player game (she could play two PC's). I also came across Lands Out of Time and the one-shot Lair of the Fat Man. I don't own either of these so I was hoping somebody who is familiar could give me their thoughts.

I don't see a point in making two PCs. But generally, much depends on how comfortable/familiar you are with converting concepts instead of specific numbers.

Graham 06-16-2012 10:07 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh (Post 1394333)
I don't see a point in making two PCs. But generally, much depends on how comfortable/familiar you are with converting concepts instead of specific numbers.

Agreed. Having a single player is limiting in some ways, but allows a depth of play that can often outweigh that achieved with two or more players. I love refereeing with just one player. You're both working on a deeper level, much more at the level of that character's thoughts. Like a novel written in first person.

Graham

OldSam 06-16-2012 02:17 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
First of all make sure that the story contains elements she (and her character) is interested in! since she is the only player that's especially important... ;) (really no other players available?)

You can find out by asking her what kind of character she wants to play!
E.g. if she wants to be a fighter she should definitely have the opportunity to use combat as a way to overcome obstacles on the way to her goal (of course not always but often). She's a thief? Let her detect traps, sneak around guards; a scout char wants to move in nature, finding hidden tracks, probably hunting etc. etc.
Then look at her character's appearance and personality:For instance is she an attractive character? Then she wants to use that in the game, let NPCs react to her attractive appearance, otherwise if she's not, find out what makes her different from the crowd and use that... (at times)

Ideally your story hook fits to the her character, e.g. a fighter could be called to rescue somebody who is taken by bandits etc.
And: Choose an easy plot - much better for both of you! ;)

Here you could find inspiration if you need it: http://www.rpglibrary.org/articles/s...ng/36plots.php


For your GURPS Game Mastering: As a rule of thumb, know that a normal, standard adventuring task does not have any modifiers (+0), it's just a normal skill or attribute roll, while a more difficult situation is penalized. A typical modifier for a harder task would be -4, e.g. to spot something that is not obvious in a low light situation. (And of course don't let her roll for trivial things that should work 99% for everyone, but you certainly know that :p)
Smaller difficulties could be that a lock is a bit rusty, so a roll on lockpicking skill could be -2 in that case - something like that, just as a rough guide ;) On the other hand, of course, an easy task should get a good bonus, normally +4, e.g. if you're not having stress and good conditions, like doing something for training.

Finally, as other's have said, rules are not that important, if you're in doubt just improvise (keep the pace) and have fun!

Stripe 06-16-2012 05:44 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1393881)
I have finally done it. I finished GURPS Lite, am planning to play my first game ever, I only have one player (my wife), but was hoping to do this on Father's Day. My wife prefers the Fantasy genre but I will most likely be running our first campaign in a fantasy setting so I am open to other ideas for our first foray into GURPS. I was hoping you fine folks could offer up some suggestions or even ideas on what I should try my hand at first? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Don't take this personally, and don't let it discourage you, but under these circumstances, your first session has a lot working against it.

GURPS isn't the easiest system to play or GM. I'm 31 now, but as a kid and preteen, I DM'ed Dungeons and dragons for years before trying my hand at GURPS (third edition). I taught myself the rules without the aid of the Internet and knew them quite well before my group made the switch. Even with my players and I having a few years experience with table top RPG's it was a rocky process.

Game mastering is a skill; a skill for which you can have exceptional talent, but a skill none the less. As a skill, it gets better the more you use it.

So, what I'm saying is, your first game is likely to be your worst.


The trouble with getting bucked off now is that this is your player's first rodeo as well. Even if you decide to get back in the saddle, your player may be less enthusiastic to do so.


My biggest point of advice it to keep your first session very simple and as short as you can possibly manage. You'll be making a PC as well, and that's going to be at least a little grueling for you both.

My suggestion for a first-session outline:

Code:

  Opening Scene
        |
  Quick Combat
        |
  Big Decision
        |
  ------------
  |          |
Choice 1    Choice 2
Outcome    Outcome
  |          |
Endgame 1  Endgame 2


Here are some tips:
  1. The golden rule of role playing: have fun. More specifically, as the GM, it's your primary duty to make sure the players have fun. That's not just the end goal; it should be at the center of nearly every decision you make during the course of planning and game play.
  2. Don't have a "pet" NPC (non-player character). Normally, this is some Mary Sue of the GM's design. The PC's (player characters) should be in the spotlight, not your NPCs.
  3. Empower your players. Role playing is about making important, meaningful choices. The PC's aren't just characters in your story; you are refereeing the PC's story. Players shouldn't be railroaded or drug on leashes into making any decision. "Do you want to save the princess or not?" That's not a decision. "Do you want to save the princess or do you want to save the kingdom instead?" Now that is a decision! Make consequences, both good and bad, to the outcomes of real decisions.
  4. Be descriptive. Your descriptions are what sets the atmosphere and immerses the player into the game. Constantly describe every detail you can. Describe every scene such the rooms in a dungeon or streets in a town. Fully describe every NPC the PC's meet: clothes, visible equipment, height, build, hair color, demeanor from body language, etc.
  5. Don't be a hard ass. Don't try to be the "great and powerful" GM. Don't be difficult. Be lenient. Be flexible. Be generous. Err on the side of fun. Be a "yes" GM instead of a "No" GM. Players will have worlds more fun under such conditions and you'll be considered a much better GM.


Lastly, I'll make the same offer to you as I do to each new fantasy GM on this board: I'll be happy to run your through a round of quick, basic combat through a voice chat program such as MSN messenger or Yahoo messenger. It takes about two hours. We'll use pre-generated characters and a map I drew and just call it out turn by turn as if we were sitting at the table. This will help you immensely. PM me if interested.


Whatever you do, don't let your first session be your last. They get better as they go.

Good luck!

OldSam 06-16-2012 08:48 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Stripe (Post 1394453)
So, what I'm saying is, your first game is likely to be your worst.

I definitely wouldn't make a big problem of his inexperience, mostly for a simple but very important reason: She, the player, has no experience at all, thus everything is new and interesting, hopefully exciting, too! :)
The expectations on the player side are a very deciding factor, of course if the players are experienced you need much more skill to fulfill their requirements! At least he has played a few sessions already, IMHO that's really sufficient for that situation.
When I think back to the days when I was a first time GM (and very young, too, many years ago), we just started playing a classic fantasy game without any experience with some guys in school. Looking back from the perspective of an experienced GM we obviously made everything "wrong". But guess what? We had a lot of fun! :) And as I had no one to give advise these days, we didn't even notice our mistakes in the beginning. But who cares if everyone has fun? ;) The requirements increase with time and experience...

So, use the help you find here, but don't be worried about doing anything wrong, just make it and have fun! :)

Mulsiphix 06-17-2012 02:14 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
I've been doing some searching on blogs for folks running their first session with new GURPS players and folks recounting the tale of their first GM session. Many people seem to believe that it is ideal for new players to run through exercises with the rules before actual play. This is supposed to give new players and GM's a way to familiarize themselves with the rules so when the storytelling starts the rules aren't as much of a distraction. Its also allegedly a great way to weed out folks who will simply not like GURPS mechanics (seriously?)

Do you guys think this would be a good idea? I asked the wife and she is more than on board to run some preliminary tests before we take a shot at our first one-shot simple first session. If so, what would be a good way to go about this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stripe (Post 1394453)
Lastly, I'll make the same offer to you as I do to each new fantasy GM on this board: I'll be happy to run your through a round of quick, basic combat through a voice chat program such as MSN messenger or Yahoo messenger. It takes about two hours. We'll use pre-generated characters and a map I drew and just call it out turn by turn as if we were sitting at the table. This will help you immensely. PM me if interested.

Thank you very much. I may just take you up on this offer. I could really use the experience. Time is the only factor holding me back right now. I will be in touch!

Jeffr0 06-17-2012 07:24 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394590)
Do you guys think this would be a good idea? I asked the wife and she is more than on board to run some preliminary tests before we take a shot at our first one-shot simple first session. If so, what would be a good way to go about this?

I lean toward a big "no" on this.

I can't stand the way groups will have one planning session for a five session campaign. (Can we just play already...?!)

Rules walkthroughs and do-overs have a place in board game teaching, but for role playing games... I get to play so little... my preference is to work the teaching into the story somehow so that players can learn on the fly. So for the opening sequence... think of a social interaction, some sort of feat, and a combat-ish thing and weave them together to form the opening hook. You may have to explain them as you go... but this is a hook, so no one has to die except some throwaway NPC....

As far as rules go... certainly in the con scene... most people don't care about the rules-- definitely not the way a referee or game junkie would. When presenting the game to a mixed bag of new players, I spend maybe two minutes on rules. ("That's your dodge score... rolling low is good....") A five minute description of setting can mushroom into a fifteen minute dissertation in response to player questions, but that never seems to happen with the rules bit!

OldSam 06-17-2012 07:30 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394590)
Do you guys think this would be a good idea? I asked the wife and she is more than on board to run some preliminary tests before we take a shot at our first one-shot simple first session. If so, what would be a good way to go about this?

Hmm... In advance I'd make one or more little tests on my own to see if I can run it without difficulties.
Then maybe one little playtest with her of 20-30 minutes or so would be not bad just to get used to the basic mechanics.

Explain and let her make a few test rolls like using ST to lift something heavy, using DX to avoid falling on slippery ground or jumping over something, use Perception to spot a hidden detail, use some skills like Stealth to sneak around, e.g. Lockpicking to open a locked door, Tracking to find a deer in the woods or Fast Talk to convince that guard to let you pass.
Make a little test fight, to show her how that works, attack, parry/dodge and damage/injury. Actually players only need to know how to make the basic attribute/skill and damage roll and for details they can always ask you (the GM) what to roll... ;)

I certainly wouldn't make more than one little test - could get boring - learning by playing is much more fun! :)

Aneirin 06-17-2012 07:47 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Doing some test combats yourself might be a good idea though.

I have been doing some combats based on the first fight I expect a PC to face. (taken on a hunt by his liege lord and a friend of the lord, they ask him to look after the friends kid whilst they go and discuss more important matters. The kid is a pain in the ass, and then, from the forest, a large boar runs at the PC with a gash in his side)

It showed me how fun combat could be. First time, I had the PC and large Boar just run into each other doing a slam. luckily, the PC wound up doing more damage and knocking the boar over! Wasn't too much to finish the boar off after that.

Second time I had the PC stand his ground and try to parry the weapon with a sword. That was a bad idea, the boar weighed so much the PC had to make a breaking roll for his weapon...and his sword broke off at the hilt! This lead to a rather long combat of the PC trying to grapple the boar to choke or wrench its neck and when that failed, trying to kick the ever looking crap out of it. The PC got him down to below zero, but the boar just refused to go unconscious...and unfortunately the PC missed a kick and fell over leading the boar to goring him!

(in both of these examples, the kid had sufficient time to run away, so at least I can accompish my task of seperating the PC from the kid so that he can be kidnapped)

I suppose if the PC does get unlucky the lord and his friend can ride back in on horseback to help the PC by tossing him a weapon or something.

OldSam 06-17-2012 08:50 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aneirin (Post 1394632)
. First time, I had the PC and large Boar just run into each other doing a slam. luckily, the PC wound up doing more damage and knocking the boar over!

Wow, really? Did you count in the speed of the boar? ;) If you did I guess the PC must be really strong or was it just extreme luck with the damage rolls...? (IRL it's almost for sure that a running boar knocks you over when it hits)

Aneirin 06-17-2012 09:05 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSam (Post 1394647)
Wow, really? Did you count in the speed of the boar? ;) If you did I guess the PC must be really strong or was it just extreme luck with the damage rolls...? (IRL it's almost for sure that a running boar knocks you over when it hits)

The PC was strong (180 points, all geared towards combat, 13 strength, 13 dex, with high pain threshold, combat reflexes, very fit and hard to kill with training with a sword and shield with a DB of 3 in fine mail armour)

The boar moved its full movement (8) and the PC moved his full movement (6) making their relative velocity 14.

The boar had a HP of 15 (strength 15)

The PC had a HP of 13 (strength 13)

That means the boar did (15x14/100) 2.1, or 2 dice of damage
The PC did (13x14/100 1.82, or 2 dice of damage.

So essentially they both had an even chance of knocking the other over (the PC did roll rell, getting 11 points of damage and the boar rolling poorly, getting 6) the boar failed his dexterity roll and fell over...unless I am missing any additional rolls, I didn't see anyting for creatures that are horizontal or with four legs or with an additional size modifier getting a bonus with slam attacks. Not sure how you would give bonuses to something with a lower centre of gravity doing a slam attack, but you are right, I would think if a human charged in with a large boar, the human would wind up the worse of it then again I have never seen it in real life!

Although in that example, the PC was charging full blast at the boar wearing mail armour! Perhaps he just gave a mighty kick to the creatures nose as he ran forward or jumped on its head making it lose its footing and fall over!

I was going to have the boar use all out attack strong, but he couldn't get to the PC in time letting the PC get the charge and the slam in, which also probably made a difference! Although in this example, I forgot to have the PC ready his weapons and he just charged in unarmed! (heroic, if it was an actual PC I would give him an extra point!)

Gold & Appel Inc 06-17-2012 09:54 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394590)
Its also allegedly a great way to weed out folks who will simply not like GURPS mechanics (seriously?)

This problem tends to be more common when you're dealing with very experienced players who are married to another game system, rather than utterly inexperienced players who are married to you.

OldSam 06-17-2012 10:41 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aneirin (Post 1394653)
The boar moved its full movement (8) and the PC moved his full movement (6) making their relative velocity 14.
...
Although in that example, the PC was charging full blast at the boar wearing mail armour!

Yes, full charge und wearing armor is certainly a good point! :)
The normal known cases where men where hit by boars IRL (usually without chance) were unarmed and not with a counter charge :)

Anyway, one thing is still not sufficient, the boar is too slow with move 8, maybe you forgot something like enhanced land move or so? Or the stats are just too low...? A wild boar can run up to 30 mph, thus I'd say move 11 or 12 would be appropriate for that encounter.

Are you sure the slam calculation is made the way you did it? The part with relative velocity looks strange somehow. That way, if it counts equally for both sides, it actually does not help me if I am much faster than my opponent.

vierasmarius 06-17-2012 11:09 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSam (Post 1394697)
Anyway, one thing is still not sufficient, the boar is too slow with move 8, maybe you forgot something like enhanced land move or so? Or the stats are just too low...? A wild boar can run up to 30 mph, thus I'd say move 11 or 12 would be appropriate for that encounter.

GURPS Basic gives Wild Boars a Move 7-8, with no mention of Enhanced Move. Based on the little I could find in a quick Googling, they could have Enhanced Move 0.5 or 1, probably with Costs FP or Maximum Duration.

Quote:

Are you sure the slam calculation is made the way you did it? The part with relative velocity looks strange somehow. That way, if it counts equally for both sides, it actually does not help me if I am much faster than my opponent.
That's pretty much how Slams work in GURPS. If you've got any bonuses to damage (such as making an All-Out Attack or using a Shield) you're better off slamming as slowly as possible - damage to both parties is reduced, but chance to knock down the target is increased.

I'd prefer combining elements from the Slam and Knockback rules, actually. You normally knock the target back one yard per ST-2 damage inflicted (though it should reasonably be per 80% of ST). In a slam, each party should roll to avoid falling down at a penalty based on the damage they received relative to their ST, probably with a bonus to stay standing for the "initiator" (though it would be equal if both are charging each other).

OldSam 06-17-2012 12:21 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vierasmarius (Post 1394705)
That's pretty much how Slams work in GURPS.

A slam situation like that never happened in my own games so far, but it seems to me that the calculation needs a fix for those cases... I'll think about it. IMHO a good starting place for better slam rules is the page of RPK: Using the simplified table listed there is faster anyway in most games ( http://www.mygurps.com/index.php?p=i&a=1h&v=0 ).
Probably it makes sense to first compare the 'basic' slam damage of each side (quickly done with the simplified table) to see who get's knocked back. Afterwards one can regularly check the occuring damage for both opponents including the relative velocity.

Mulsiphix 06-17-2012 01:50 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Our focus has changed. We now know that we want to do whatever it takes to get started playing Dungeon Fantasy. A new thread on this topic has been started here. Thank you all so very much for your feedback. Your time and advice is greatly appreciated!

Stripe 06-17-2012 02:48 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394590)
Do you guys think this would be a good idea?

It can be, but it's more appropriate for experienced players looking to polish off some rust. It's fun when it's a gladiator-type mini game before the campaign starts and it gives players an opportunity to familiarize themselves with their characters and tweak them if need be. It's how I start most of mine.

To the contrary, for a first-time player, it's quite the opposite situation; I'm telling you, it will seem like a tedious rules exercise. Don't!

Have your first combat be very simple, quick and easy. Not so easy it makes it seem like it was meant to be won, but easy enough that it won't get drug out.

For example, a ST 9, IQ 9, DX 12, HT 10 goblin with a spear and no armor. Brawling and Spear skills at 12. Or, have a strong (ST 12) yet drunk mercenary with Knife and Brawling at an effective 8 pull a large knife and start attacking.

Those should be easy wins, but dangerous and very likely to cause serious injury. Since it's fantasy, a healing potion or trip to the cleric and your PC will be fixed right up.


As opposed to a first-time player, a first-time GM, on the other hand, needs to practice considerably beforehand. You'll be teaching the rules to someone else, after all.

Jeffr0 06-17-2012 03:06 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Stripe (Post 1394761)
...

To the contrary, for a first-time player, it's quite the opposite situation; I'm telling you, it will seem like a tedious rules exercise. Don't!

...

As opposed to a first-time player, a first-time GM, on the other hand, needs to practice considerably beforehand. You'll be teaching the rules to someone else, after all.

Quoted for truth.

Listen to this guy. Run yourself through the game as if you were a player. Then when you run it with a friend... keep the game moving at all costs. When they do something unexpected, just make up a ruling without looking anything up. Between sessions... study the rules to see if following them would have made it more fun. If the same thing comes up again... don't explain it too much unless the player calls you out for changing the rules. If they say something that indicates they are expecting the rule to be the same as you did last time... that is the time to explain what you've learned... but only in about ten seconds or so.

Stripe 06-17-2012 03:40 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
^Very good advice right there. It's all too easy to get your nose stuck in the book, your brain locked in infinite loop. This is excruciating for players.

Keep it fun. Keep it simple. Keep it fun. Keep it rolling. Keep it fun. Keep it quick. Keep it fun. Keep it interesting. Keep it fun.

Mulsiphix 06-17-2012 03:41 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
I'm starting to feel like I'm making a mistake going with GURPS. There is so much warning and precaution I feel like the wind is draining from my sails. I'm starting to regret leaving BattleTech a couple of years ago. We had a blast playing that at least. It was super complex and rule lawyering around every corner. I guess that is what drew me to GURPS in the first place. The complexity and chance of endless possibilities. I've never had trouble digesting wargaming rules, why should GURPS be any different?

Jeffr0 06-17-2012 03:54 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394789)
I'm starting to feel like I'm making a mistake going with GURPS.

The advice in this thread is mostly generic game mastering advice. It is not reflective of GURPS's inherent complexity, but rather of the depth of the challenge of collaborative storytelling. I'd give you pretty much the same counsel if you were going with Labyrinth Lord.

Stripe 06-17-2012 04:02 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Wow. Best example of "brightest flame, shortest lived" I've yet to have seen on here. Heck, anywhere as a matter of fact. XD

Don't get discouraged, but set realistic goals. With very little table-top RPG experience, you're wanting to teach yourself GURPS Fourth Edition and Dungeon Fantasy in great haste? That's not a very realistic goal.

GURPS may not be the right system for you. Then again, you may love it for the reasons you stated. Quit before you even try and you'll never know, but at least you'll have more money in your pocket! XD

OldSam 06-17-2012 04:09 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394789)
I'm starting to feel like I'm making a mistake going with GURPS. There is so much warning and precaution I feel like the wind is draining from my sails.

Don't think too much about the warnings, mostly they are generic (not specific for GURPS) and also your 1:1 situation is much easier than the typical case for a new GM with a group of experienced and demanding players. The most important thing is to have fun! As long as you have fun in your game, it can't be wrong.

It's good to read the warnings but just take what actually helps you at the moment, don't think you need everything. No one can digest all at once, everyone started at zero in the past... ;)
GURPS Lite version is really simple, you'll have no problems with that and the great thing about the system is that it grows with your experience. Using the Basic Set you can add much more details later on if you want! ;)

btw, with reference to Dungeon Fantasy:
A very good choice, but first my advise would be to play a few lite sessions in advance!
Really, it will be much simpler for you that way and most likely also much more fun, because you and your wife don't have to learn all the rules at the same time!
First have fun with the lite stuff, then building on that experience, expand to the big things with DF! ;)

Good luck and enjoy your games!

whswhs 06-17-2012 09:50 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394789)
I'm starting to feel like I'm making a mistake going with GURPS. There is so much warning and precaution I feel like the wind is draining from my sails. I'm starting to regret leaving BattleTech a couple of years ago. We had a blast playing that at least. It was super complex and rule lawyering around every corner. I guess that is what drew me to GURPS in the first place. The complexity and chance of endless possibilities. I've never had trouble digesting wargaming rules, why should GURPS be any different?

Your original post didn't make that clear; it sounded as if you had not run any rpg before, or at least as if you had not gamed with your wife before. So you were getting some advice aimed at a neophyte.

GURPS is actually a very accessible game at the level of basic principles. There are really only three dice rolls, after all: reaction roll, skill/attribute roll, and damage roll.

Bill Stoddard

Tinman 06-18-2012 01:02 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1394789)
I'm starting to feel like I'm making a mistake going with GURPS. There is so much warning and precaution I feel like the wind is draining from my sails. I'm starting to regret leaving BattleTech a couple of years ago. We had a blast playing that at least. It was super complex and rule lawyering around every corner. I guess that is what drew me to GURPS in the first place. The complexity and chance of endless possibilities. I've never had trouble digesting wargaming rules, why should GURPS be any different?

While GURPS is somwhat complex to start, a little bit of effort will take you a long way.

Just starting with some of the basics will get you going & as you get used to the rules it's easy to add on the layers. The, biggest danger I have found is getting overwhelmed with the rules.

All that being said, once you get the hang of it it's easy. It the learning curve is not hard. Just take small bites to start.
I thing GURPS is great & is a very rewarding system.

enjoy & good luck

Mulsiphix 06-20-2012 02:39 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
I've gone over the entire thread today taking notes. I think I was a little hasty earlier when I said I felt like my enthusiasm was dimming from all the warning I was receiving. I just can't stop thinking about GURPS and all that I want to do with it. This is our current plan of action:
  1. We both read through GURPS Lite (done!)
  2. Build two PC's at the same time together
  3. Run a simple gladiator style test fight (map)
  4. Run a super simple test adventure (as described by Stripe)
  5. Play through Caravan to Ein Arris
  6. Move onto preparing for Dungeon Fantasy #1&2 if all goes well
I just want to thank everybody who contributed to this thread. Especially to those who expressed caution but also backed it up with great advice and enthusiasm. Looking at my combined notes I am very excited and feel I have a very solid plan for moving forward. My wife is extremely excited to be playing tonight and continues to assure me that she has no expectations other than to play. She is very gung-ho about making this work and wants so badly to move onto Dungeon Fantasy (old-school style). Thank you all very much! I will be sure to post an update as soon as progress has been made =)

Kuroshima 06-20-2012 03:08 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1396040)
I just want to thank everybody who contributed to this thread. Especially to those who expressed caution but also backed it up with great advice and enthusiasm. Looking at my combined notes I am very excited and feel I have a very solid plan for moving forward. My wife is extremely excited to be playing tonight and continues to assure me that she has no expectations other than to play. She is very gung-ho about making this work and wants so badly to move onto Dungeon Fantasy (old-school style). Thank you all very much! I will be sure to post an update as soon as progress has been made =)

I can't wait to hear about your updates. Not everyone is lucky enough to have a SO that not only accepts that you game, but joins you (my SO accepts that I game, but while she tried, she never got the hang of it)

EDIT: Oh, and IMHO, you could jump in and play Caravan directly. It will be easier than you building your first, simple adventure.

Jeffr0 06-20-2012 03:49 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Just a random suggestion for #4:

The Tomb of Sigyfel would be drop dead simple to convert to GURPS and it would be hard to NOT embellish it a little.

OldSam 06-21-2012 08:37 AM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulsiphix (Post 1396040)
I just can't stop thinking about GURPS and all that I want to do with it. This is our current plan of action: [...]

Sounds great, I'm quite sure you're on a very good way now. Enjoy your first game session! ;)

Mulsiphix 06-21-2012 01:06 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffr0 (Post 1396094)
Just a random suggestion for #4:

The Tomb of Sigyfel would be drop dead simple to convert to GURPS and it would be hard to NOT embellish it a little.

This actually looks fantastic. How do I go about converting it though? As long as I stick with concepts vs direct conversion, I should be okay right? There doesn't appear to be anything troublesome. The monster encounter table for adventurers traveling to the tomb could just be replaced with entries from an online bestiary yeah? Thank you!

Mulsiphix 06-28-2012 08:30 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
All right folks we had our very first GURPS session tonight. It wasn't too exciting as we both felt the need for doing a combat simulation first. It was just to get the flow of combat and to become familiar with common stats and rolls. It was a 4 on 4 battle using only simplified NPC Record Cards, no skills/advantages/disadvantages and even no armor (just shields). I made the horrible mistake of starting out with three of my four guys going with all-out attacks and my wife beat the living crap out of me that first round. It all went downhill from there for me. So our next step is playing a little adventure and I think Jeffr0's suggestion of The Tomb of Sigyfel.

The process of play was much harder than I had first imagined and I was very glad to be training with the system before jumping into telling a story. My wife had a lot of fun and even offered to help convert the adventure, though I think I'll keep the limited story a secret if I can =). My next step is to convert this from LL to GURPS tonight and actually roll up a couple of real characters tomorrow and play through it. I think the hardest part for me with the conversion is going to be converting the LL map to a similar sized GURPS dungeon. I'll have to look into how much space a box is in a LL labyrinth. Just wanted to give you guys an update. Thank you again for all of your help!

Refplace 06-28-2012 09:54 PM

Re: [GURPS Lite] First Time, Need Suggestions
 
Sweet. Oh and since I saw the Battletech comment yeah if you enjoyed Battle tech GURPS should be a breeze once you get the hang of it.
And you learned your first strategy tip. All out attack is really risky!


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