Re: Generation Ships
 

Well, ÆS is pretty odd, but has its reasons to trying the tech out (the box versions, that is). Partial replacements I see as something more 'down-to-earth'.

So . . . what do you say about re/starting the discussion of early cyborgs and cyborg organs outside this thread?

Re: Generation Ships
 

So it was in that spirit that you repeatedly asked other people to cite sources supporting their beliefs?

Re: Generation Ships
 

I think it would be military in nature with alot of scientific training.

I don't believe any kind of "democratic" system would work but a safety valve might be the promise of some kind of freedom for one's descendants at PlanetFall.

Re: Generation Ships
 

Respectfully, can you explain why you beleive this?

If we're contemplating a 200 year voyage and look back over the last 200 years of our history it is only democracies that have endured that long.

There are specialized exceptions like Monaco and Vatican City of course, Vatican City really doesn't look like a good model for a generation ship. :)

Monaco depends on income from outside its' borders and there isn't going to be an "outside".

Contrariwise, over the last 200 years military dictatorships are exactly the type of government most likely to end in a violent crash.

Soldiers only live wth their failies during peacetime and peacetime militaries are notoriously subject to mission drift.

The genship might look like a University community. Those seem very self-contained and separated from outside reality. If it's a co-ed university it even avoids the Vatican City problem.

The university model could also be sort of democratic with a Board of Trustees elected from the community and a President who answers to the Board. Not actually very diffeerent from many small to mid-szed munciplanities.

The football would suck though. :)

Re: Generation Ships
 

If we're talking about a generation ship's administration the conditions are completely different then they are on earth. A ship cannot afford to have people staging revolts nor would they unless they're psychotically suicidal.
How stringent the rule of a military-style gov't would be is completely dependent on the conditions on-board the ship. Where decisions may need to be made in a timely manner for sake of the ship's survival. As someone who worked in the University/College environment for almost a decade and a half. The university model would not work unless the people were taken care of by some kind of automated systems that hardly ever needed attention. It all boils down to what is most efficient and most conducive to the survival of the people on the ship. Democracies whatever their form are for societies who's survival doesn't require tight structures and timely decisions. Such as may be the case on a generation ship.

Re: Generation Ships
 

<shrug> If you can't afford revolts you can't afford overly authoritarian governments that inspire revolts. A military without enemies is also rather oxymoronic.

I am also puxxled by this view that a genship will be in a state of perpetual emergency teetering on the brink of disaster if swift choices are not made.

Interstellar space is _empty_. it is empty in ways that bring new breadth and meaning to the word "emptiness". The problems of a genship are matters of long term sustainability and not short term crisis.

You may have to be stern in telling would be parents that they can't all ahve enough children at the same time to form a decent pee-wee footballl league but you also have to e consisstant in saying that year after year. Near-stasis is probably desirable.

Planning for a government that will be capable of ordering 10% of the population into the recycling system is better spent avoiding that cirses whatever it would be. This mythical crisis would probably end with the overpopulation problem being solved by the overthrow the dictatorship that ordered it.

Re: Generation Ships
 

As for Government onboard the vessel, it depends on who is undertaking this trek anyways. Corporate sponsored? Goverment Sponsored? Rich Elite? And what conditions spurred the creation of the Generation Ship... Refugees? Explorers? Staking land claims? Crazy flight of fancy?

Answer that, and you'll have a good idea about the government/adminastation onboard.

Personally, I can't imagine this before Late TL9, Truthfully without some unusal circumstances, I can't imagine a Generation Ship at all rather than an AI piolted Seed Ship.

Maybe we should focus on what events would need to take place to make a Generation Ship a plausible outcome, then work from there.

Re: Generation Ships
 

Yo Fred

It seems you're making alot of assumptions, as we all are , about the nature of life aboard said Gen Ship. My question to would be is why do you believe a military-style (namely regimented and subject to orders) would automatically be subject to revolts?

And Trachmyr pointed out it also depends on who and why said gen ship is being sent out.

Re: Generation Ships
 

Sounds cool.

Re: Generation Ships
 

Anything might be "subject" to "revolts". The question is when are they more likely?

The key issue there is change of government. If turnover of Parliament/Congress/Presidency is not a normal and regular thing the it is only by revolt that the governemnt can be changed.

Related to this is the Succession Crisis. If a government is not prepared to chnge leadership regualry but instead changes only upon the death of the old leader this leads to a great reduction of long term stability.

These factors make relatively good democracies very unlikely to suffer revolts. Why start a Civil War when you could win the next election? People reach the threshold to vote the current rascals out a good bit before they reach the one about bloody revolution.

"Regimented and subject to orders" could describe a lot of people's regular jobs...... while they are on the job. The need to regiment people's private lives and make them subject to orders in normally priovate matters is the rub.

In that area it is only in the matter of reproduction that I see any need to "regiment" and a lot of potential discontent could be avoided by striving intently to build "fairness" into the system.

So I see little need for military-style regimentation in general life aboard a genship and I see military-style autocracy as actively counterproductive.