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-   -   [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable? (https://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=74919)

sir_pudding 11-30-2010 03:03 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran (Post 1085124)
That's why no one smokes.
Neither does everyone.
Quote:
If death isn't enough of a motivator now, why on earth do you think culture could overcome it?
Let's see. First historically societies have undertaken certain projects that took generations to complete. Second, we don't have any examples of societies that contain AI, but I see no reason why they shouldn't be able to plan for the long term.
Quote:
That's simply more optimistic about human nature than I could ever be.
Perhaps the point of postulating alien cultures is that they might be different from your own?

Ulzgoroth 11-30-2010 03:06 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran (Post 1085124)
That's why no one smokes.
If death isn't enough of a motivator now, why on earth do you think culture could overcome it? That's simply more optimistic about human nature than I could ever be.
Even individuals, on the other hand, have long been smart enough not to eat their seed corn. Not all the anecdata cut the same way.

Also, not everyone has to be a long-term thinker for the culture as a whole to look ahead.

Flyndaran 11-30-2010 03:07 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sir_pudding (Post 1085131)
Neither does everyone.
Let's see. First historically societies have undertaken certain projects that took generations to complete. Second, we don't have any examples of societies that contain AI, but I see no reason why they shouldn't be able to plan for the long term.
Perhaps the point of postulating alien cultures is that they might be different from your own?
What projects have taken generations to complete that didn't have more immediate short term goals?
Even then it's mostly a case of an individual imposing their singular will on many others over his own lifetime. As a species with any sort of democratic government, immediate gratification will be the rule.

Flyndaran 11-30-2010 03:09 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth (Post 1085133)
Even individuals, on the other hand, have long been smart enough not to eat their seed corn. Not all the anecdata cut the same way.

Also, not everyone has to be a long-term thinker for the culture as a whole to look ahead.
I think it's the opposite. For a culture to think ahead, most members must do it.

sir_pudding 11-30-2010 03:30 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran (Post 1085134)
What projects have taken generations to complete that didn't have more immediate short term goals?
Any number of spiritual projects undertaken by monastic societies. The Long Now Foundation's various projects. Cathedrals (Tours for example took over 300 years to be completed). Various agricultural techniques that improve soil. Holland.
Quote:
As a species with any sort of democratic government,
Species don't have governments, societies do.
Quote:
immediate gratification will be the rule.
Is it impossible to imagine alternatives? Or is dismal failure and grimdark distopia the only possible future?

vicky_molokh 11-30-2010 03:37 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran (Post 1085134)
As a species with any sort of democratic government
Which need not be the case.

Flyndaran 11-30-2010 03:39 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sir_pudding (Post 1085150)
...
Is it impossible to imagine alternatives? Or is dismal failure and grimdark distopia the only possible future?
I don't think it's distopian to understand how humanity works. I have optimism that when we use up resources etc., we will pushed to the brink yet find our way to other horizons.

Flyndaran 11-30-2010 03:40 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh (Post 1085154)
Which need not be the case.
Of course. That's why I wrote it. But as they say, democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others.

sir_pudding 11-30-2010 03:41 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran (Post 1085155)
I don't think it's distopian to understand how humanity works. I have optimism that when we use up resources etc., we will pushed to the brink yet find our way to other horizons.
Yet for some reason you are arguing that a hypothetical game society that is merely willing to grow darker plants on one side of a comet than the other cannot possibly exist. Why?

Flyndaran 11-30-2010 03:44 PM
Re: [Space/Spaceships] TL9 nomad fleet - playable?
 
Because I like thread drifts?


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