Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

I thought it was all crass. The bad guys are X is a sort of moral pov to be righteous and to justify behaving like bastards.

However, I am thinking of running a DF soon and I am very much tempted by this idea now it is proposed. Simply come up with an absurd mix of 'evil' types and roll dice on it, who are the evil people this week.

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

But would you say that burning out a nest of face huggers is 'behaving like a bastard'?

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

Close -- it is what it sounds like. In film and literature, as long as a non-human enemy speaks, it can be treated as WE. If it does not speak, or once it can no longer speak, it can safely be THEY.

The gold standard in this thread for let's-kill-them-without-compunction seems to be facehuggers. If they could plead for their lives and entreat mercy, would they be treated differently?

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

Probably. But I also think that this is a requirement for being able to class something as evil.

Things that relentlessly attack and kill people because they are predators are not evil, they're vermin. Things that relentlessly attack because their brains are wired that way are at best borderline. Things that could negotiate, and actually have the concept of mercy, but deliberately choose not to show any, those are evil. Even leaving aside the morality, the story elements are going to be different. A predator can't discover something is more horrible from the victim's point of view and change tactics to do that instead of the way it was killing them, an evil thing can, and depending on why it is evil, it might.

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

How about a different example: The aliens from Independence Day. They can certainly speak to each other, and under some conditions they can also speak to humans (telepathic communication, as well as killing a lab doctor and manipulating his vocal cords externally).

So what if human infiltrators somehow stumbled upon a nursery pod in the alien mothership? Moral quandary?

What about if, after destroying the alien invasion, a nursery pod crashed on the earth with its alienspawn alive and intact? Moral quandary?

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

The xenomorphs are a slightly different issue. To them we are resources to be used as needed. They aren't exactly evil, just their way of life is incompatible with our own.

Most depictions of fantasy races don't go that far, and races tend to have cultures that are hostile, but not down right alien.
I'm guessing that's a typo, but it is one way to solve the problem ;)

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

So far this thread is interesting to me. I guess I wil say that it is true the we tend to humanize everything as long as they look human but once they are too ugly, sorry about your luck. All people would be offended if a person squished a puppy but it you squish a mosquito or other insect there is no problem. Also, the idea of beings who willfully choose evil are ok to kill but maybe the orcs, trolls and the like also choose to be evil. Orcs in the Lord of the Rings were quite nasty because they liked to be. They didn't seem to feel that they needed any justification for what they were doing; they did what their masters told willingly.

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

Well, this is true, up to a point (And this thread is rapidly approaching a "Philosophy 101" stage, which isn't necessarily a bad thing...just....EVIL! :)).

The trick is, you start having to define Evil. As Neo says "It comes down to choice" - If the "Evil" guys don't have a choice (ie: Xenomorphs), then you can argue they're just behaving to their nature - and it's just that their nature is incompatible with yours. You can't reason with a Xenomorph, it has basically two states; dead or trying to kill you.

When choice enters into it, you then get to identify "Good":

Will a good character kill indiscriminately? (Burning a Orc Village with young and old in it don't sound very "good" to me.)
Will a "Good" character attempt to turn "Evil" characters to the "right" path? (I've always wanted to play a 12th level Jehovah's Witness)

And at that point well, human society still hasn't answered completely what is "good" and "evil" so I just makes my call and goes with it in my poor l'il campaign. :)

Mr. Bone: "Hecuba, Have you seen the new movie? I was thinking of going to see it."
Hecuba: "Yes, master....her butler did it!"
Mr. Bones: "But Hecuba, I haven't seen the Movie yet...EVIL!"

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

Yes. Their evil nature. Because you see, it doesn't come down to choice. Who knows whether any of us have a real choice?

Re: [DF] Why not have some pure "bad guy" races in DF?
 

"You enter a ten by ten room. In it is a small cube farm full of orcish telemarketers."

Evil enough?