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Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Thank you, roguebfl, I'll read it.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ellie the Technomancer

Also, leather armor is at most DR2, so one hit can cause a lot of damage. With HT 13, 8 points of damage puts you at half move and dodge. Also, a major wound to the face or vitals gives a -5 penalty to the HT roll; -10 for the brain.

I'm thinking of the unpleasant results of a 'crippling' hit to the leg. With all those points in HT, Speed, etc., a really high HP total isn't likely, so 7 points should be enough. Assuming a cutting weapon that's 5 points after armour, or 7 points of basic damage. A character with ST12 and a broadsward will get this on half their hits. Once that's happened you count as Lame (no legs), and that means you're effectively out of the fight.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polaris

Jim-Bob,

As I already showed on the Uberthread (and others did as well), it is possible to get a dodge of 13 or even more (as high as 19!) with "default" stat characters (stats of 10). In short, you can get shockingly high Dodge defense scores for a suprisingly low number of points.

However, not everyone entirely agreed with your figures, and nor did we find them that shocking once the maths had been done.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claudius

Thank you, roguebfl, I'll read it.

Good luck. You need it.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha

I like giving semi-skilled fighters the option of effectively swinging half-wild and possibly connecting.
This is actually pretty realistic when you think about the effect of a semi-skilled fighter fancing an expert, and trying his best to connect by deception.
He's more likely to fail, but he'll still try to do it.

Still, this is an house rule, and still it doesn't change the fact that Deceptive Attack is mostly worthless for skills 12-

Quote:

All the more reason to use it, especially for NPCs against PCs at a 3:1 ratio.

I really don't follow you. I showed in the previous post that your reasoning about hit chances is flawed. So should a competent fighter (skill 12) lower his chance to connect just to save PCs?

And note that to "connect" you have to hit and he has to fail defense.

Quote:

I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to avoid, and why.

I don't like the fact that with your house rule:

Once you get hit, all the following hits connect (barring exceptional cases)
The GM knows when an NPC will or will not hit.

I call the above problems "hit spiral".

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polaris

Yes, you showed that it is possible under all the right circumstances to have a "default" stat character get a high Dodge. But as was pointed out, the "default" stat character has a Basic Speed of 5, base Dodge of 8. With an All-Out-Defense he gets a Dodge of 10, with a Retreat you can a Dodge of 13 against Melee and with Dodge and Drop you can get a Dodge of 13 against Ranged (one shot as then you are prone and Dodging becomes even harder) Of course, to get these high numbers, you have to pretty much choose to give up attacking your opponent and just hope that you can stay under that 83% chance of not getting hit (that is, if your opponent doesn't use Feints and Deceptive attacks to reduce your Dodge score) Against a single opponent you stand a chance. Against multiple opponents which can surround you, you're gonna have a problem. Against a single ranged opponent, well once you hit the dirt they get -2 to hit and you have -3 to your Dodge and can't get the extra +3 for Dodge and Drop, which brings you to a Dodge of 7 with the All-Out-Defense option. Against multiple ranged attackers, well you can't be aware of all of them so there's a distinct chance that there will be attacks you just can't even roll a Dodge.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ellie the Technomancer

11 is nowhere near 14. 11+ is what, 63% success? 14+ is around 93%. So this is a major difference.

11 is just a retreat away from 14. But the retreat is only against one opponent, so it doesn't help so much against 3:1.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpram

11 is just a retreat away from 14. But the retreat is only against one opponent, so it doesn't help so much against 3:1.

It is also just a "drop for cover" away for ranged attacks, and that *does* apply to all ranged attacks for that second.

-Polaris

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polaris

Neither of these is available for ranged attacks, hence at least part of the problem.

-Polaris

And who said anything about ranged attacks? Reread the original post.

Re: Active defense debate o_Ô

Guys, we are NOT resurrecting the Uber Thread here. Keep the subject on track, and no thread hijacking.

I'm not gonna be patient on this.