Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

The point I'm trying to get at here is that from the standpoint of a third party observer, there is nothing to distinguish between civilizations B and C, each of which have a different subset of the technologies of homeline, and civilization A, which has yet a third (smaller) subset of the technologies of homeline plus something homeline does not have at all.

It's just as valid to call the hypothetical union of A, B and C, the the standard, and say that all three of them, and Homeline's TL6 as well, all have the Union TL6, retarded in a different areas, and that for any of them to acquire the missing piece is simply a case of buying off their retardation in that particular area. It's a change of perspective that makes the concepts of this or that technology being too divergent to compensate for, or any view of the buyoff process as asymmetrical between any pair of them, look much less reasonable.

Choice of zero issues like that come up a lot in alternate worlds situations. My personal favorite is the sometimes question "Why are so many alternate worlds variations of the history of Homeline". Possible answer: "They aren't, they're all really variations of the history of Bonaparte-4, and the most important date in history must have been 1798, cause there sure are a lot worlds that diverge with Napoleon not invading Ireland".

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

Remember that the Basic Set points out realistic societies tend to have a range of TLs not only between categories but within them as well.

Take a look at the US power grid for example; it is a mostly TL6 system with a few TL7 and TL8 improvements added on in places. There are a few things in Medicine that still use TL6 or even TL5 methods and so on.

Even fantasy worlds have this range if you know how to look at them and this range will apply to divergent TL as well. Take the Space 1889 setting where you have TL5, TL5^, TL6, TL6^, TL(5+1), TL(5+1)^, and the occasional TL(5+2)/(6+1) and TL(5+2)^/(6+1)^ gizmo all mixed together.

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

Sure we can image magical TL(3+5); the AD&D setting Spelljammer used Transportation TL(3+5) to move between planets. Now imagining an entire society at magical TL(3+5) is doable but if it was anything realistic the TL would be a range perhaps TL(3+3) to TL(3+5) with some TL^ throw in for good measure.

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

[QUOTE=Manul]
Technomancer (Merlin-1) is given TL(7+1). Azoth-7 (IW112) at TL(4+2), Azoth-1 at TL(4+3) (IW113), Azoth-5 (IW113) at TL(3+4), Lucifer-5 with TL6 and power and aerospace at TL6^ (IW132-3), Merlin-2 at TL8, Merlin-3 at TL6 (IW133-4), Nostradamus with a mixture of TL4 and TL8 thanks to
Reich-5 (IW138), Sherlock-2 at TL6^ which has Van Helsing (and one would
assume Vampires) running around (IW137), and Wyvern with its spell throwing
dragons and TL6 (IW142, Dragons 107-123).

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

Malloyd, you seem to have a good point. However, it points out another 'choice of zero': the default 'width' of a TL. And yes, it is very humanocentric: we assume that OUR TLs are of the default 'width', and thus any 'narrower' TL is retarded in several fields. And, as stated everywhere, we consider TLs that are retarded in some fields, but ALSO have inventions we never had to compensate, to be Divergent. So far so good. But what about a civilization that has all the homeline stuff AND divergent stuff. Well, they will look like a very advanced civilization. Not because of higher overall TL - they don't have that - but because they have higher TLs than we do in fields we didn't consider.

This 'Divergent TLs are Split TLs too' PoV actually makes maintaining divergence easier. Why? Because it makes sure that the hypothetical reverse-engineer suffers BOTH the Divergent penalty of -2, AND the standard penalty for working with a higher TL. The only problem with this approach is that it makes pricing different divergent TLs difficult, because some are wider and some are narrower than homeline TLs.

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

Not especially. Take "Batman TAS". It has some divergent tech, like the police dirigibles. It does not look very advanced. It just looks weird. But note that unless divergent tech can find a distinct niche for itself, it will be displaced in short order.

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

Well, some stuff is indeed not cool enough to stay. I'll try to bring examples that are more impressive, and try to make it so that they become even more interesting when combined with homeline tech.

Fully ablative DR - a suit with x5 DR, but ablative - is great at TL3+1 for charging into lines of musket gunmen. Tesla's TL5+1 power-sending tech (IW-Gernsback, IIRC) is great for us even today. Some of the TLx+y vehicles from GURPS Fantasy could be a huge advantage in homeline warfare. A TL0+6 Aquatic civilization's intentions would be very useful for human TL6 marine industry. Even TL8 nukes would be an impressive addition to the TL3+7 Protoss force (assuming they in on and USE them).

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

Tesla's power-sending tech is superscience plain and simple. They just hadn't made the distinction yet.

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

While this seems true given our (modern) understanding of how electricity works, it doesn't make a difference: it's still some piece of tech that homeline doesn't have, and would benefit from. Their effect FOR A GAMING WORLD is the same as that from non-superscience intentions. (And despite a good definition, the line between divergent tech and superscience is blurry, because we've already been through ages when something was CONSIDERED superscience, such as heavier-than-air powered manned flight, supersonic movement of living humans, or synthesis of organic chemicals. But now I'm rambling.)

Oh, and the other examples still stand.

Re: Problems and Solutions of keeping Divergent TL paths Divergent?
 

[QUOTE=Molokh]But what it isn't, is divergent technology. We have no equivalent of it.