Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

Don't forget, the average driving situation requires no rolls at all, and that Driving also defaults to IQ. A lot of normal modern folks are going to be using the IQ default instead of the DX default as soon as they're old enough to have some sort of education, experience, and general non-dumbassery.

That said, for a person who is dead-normal across the board, I think operating a vehicle at Default of 5 is realistic. That gives them a 2:1 chance of failure (IE: Doing something a cop would pull you over for, or a "no harm, no foul" fender-bender) in any sort of stressful situation that requires a roll but still grants the +4 TDM, and about a 10% chance of pulling off a miracle in a real crisis without the TDM.

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

Is there a list of TDMs anywhere (in a book somewhere or on the forums)?

That'd be a right handy thing to have.

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

The way I look at Driving and skill rolls:

The driver, alone in the car or with quiet passengers, no radio playing, no cellphone, focusing on driving, normal driving conditions (Dry road, good lighting, nobody actively trying to kill you) -- no skill check required.

The driver, with a distraction of some sort such as rowdy kids in the back seat, or talking on the cell phone while driving, but normal driving conditions -- skill check at +4 for routine operation.

The driver, with no distractions but less than ideal conditions - it's raining, it's dark out, the road is in bad shape, whatever -- make a skill check starting at +3 (for light rain or dust, dark road but otherwise good conditions) and possibly going down to -4 (torrential rain or blizzard conditions, in the dark, on a bad road). Note that Taking Extra Time (by driving slowly) is good for bonuses to help offset these penalties!

Distractions in bad conditions add further penalties onto the above - talking on a hands-free cellphone might be good for -1, juggling a handheld phone and a hot coffee is a -4 at best.

Failure on a Driving roll indicates something like missing your exit on the freeway, taking a wrong turn, a flat tire, stuck in a snowbank, or if failed by 5 or more a minor bumper-denter accident for less than $500 in damages or a point of damage from dumping hot coffee all over yourself. Mostly failed rolls result in delays and frayed nerves.
A critical failure may indicate getting a traffic ticket for driving through an intersection, or the possibility of a more severe accident - roll again to prevent disaster and turn it into just $500 or less in damages.


My Suggestion: if you're ever caught in a blizzard, at night, with little Jack and little Molly and the Tickle-Me-Elmo, yell at the kids to shut the heck up, throw Elmo out the window, and turn off your cellphone.


EDIT: Some cars may be good for a +1 or more Quality bonus on Driving checks for bad conditions. The Cadilacs with the heads-up night vision displays would remove Darkness as a concern, the cars with bumper-mounted radar, driver-wakeup systems, and drifting alarms would help combat driver fatigue (possibly giving the driver a second skill check if he fails the first one) and all the computers and such would be worth a +1 or more on the second, "avert utter disaster" roll.

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

Realistic?

Someone who bumps into other cars or is pulled over two times out of three when she faces a stressful situation in a car isn't an average driver. She's a menace who shouldn't be driving at all.

A friend of mine has had about six minor accidents over a year of driving and that's considered an insanely high amount, not the normal cost of doing business.

A fender-bender isn't a routine thing. It's either the result of freak unluckiness or it's due to a basic lack of competence. If someone has them regularly, that person is noticably a poor driver, not just a normal person. I've never had one in my years of driving and neither has anyone I'd consider a competent driver.

A normal person in a Western country probably spends a couple of hours a day in a car. Even someone with a short commute will often spend an average of an hour a day driving.

Are you going to tell me that during all this driving, people don't learn something?

Is a 16-year-old kid who has seen cars driven equally good at it as a 25-year-old with seven to eight years of experience driving a car?

I think the idea that 'normal people have Driving at default' is rather strange. I mean, if it were any other skill that's used that often, would we even hesitate to say that normal people have at least a point in it?

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

As a professional driver, I see a lot of people who are menaces that shouldn't be driving at all IMHO.

The normal commute doesn't challenge those people at all.

See my comments about not disregarding the IQ default. Insurance companies certainly don't.

It's an undying debate, yes.

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

One, I'm curious about how your theoretical driver is suddenly a woman.

Two, failed driving rolls certainly don't lead to accidents or tickets, any more than a failed Broadsword roll results in stabbing yourself, a failed Writing roll results in accidentally insulting your target audience, or a failed Photography roll results in taking photographs of the inside of the lenscap (or breaking the camera). Disasters, like car accidents, should be reserved for critical failures, or at the very least for long strings of regular failures.

I've worked tech support. The vast majority of people don't have a point in Computer Operation, have no desire to have a point in Computer Operation, and actively resist your every effort to train them until they have a point in Computer Operation. I've given lessons to people who go deliberately, actively, and maliciously deaf when you try to explain anything to them. They just want their emails and their funny cat pictures and youtube videos, and the rest of it can go hang.

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

I'd say most drivers on the road have a point or two in Driving.

I've only had a driver's license for 4 years, and I've always lived in areas with public transit, hence my not yet having a point in Driving. (It's also possible that I've got Incompetence, given my driving record :P.)

Assuming you get normal "learning on the job" points for driving, then if someone has an hour-long commute each way, five days a week 50 weeks a year, they should get about a point every year and a half or so.

At some point it'll stop increasing because they're not doing anything different enough that they're actually learning from their experience -- or maybe they'll start improving the Technique/E "Driving from my house to work and back".


EDIT: Okay, but Bruno makes a good point. Maybe most people don't have a point in Driving. *Shrug*

I assumed it was because we kept talking about a "mommy".

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

Most people drive at default...

The fact that the road is typically flat, clear and wide (those who've driven in Europe know what I mean) and that the other drivers are not trying to harm the drivers gives a bonus to the roll and this translate to a good default.

You see minor failures on the road all the time: The guy that's riding with a wheel on the shoulder, the guys spilling his coffee during a turn; the guy that leaves on the turn signal for 40 miles; that guy breaking for no appear ant reason (in that case you may have missed a perception roll); wrong turns; turning when the signal clearly states that you are not allowed, over/under speeding; backing up in a garbage can, a curb or "...eek" another car... Even having to break strongly last minute means that someone somewhere missed their driving skill validation.

The driver's ed course is just enough to remove an additional unfamiliarity penalty.

Most of the time there are no rolls required, you may even have time to play license plate poker.

EtVous

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

The only person I can think of who regularly failes during routine driving is a girl I know.

Failed driving rolls probably don't lead to dangerous accidents, but they probably lead to some consequences. After all, if you're in a metal box travelling at sixty miles per hour and you fail at controlling it, it's probably going to have some consequences you don't like.

Re: old theme - What exactly is default?
 

It's still a minority of drivers. We just notice the bad drivers more.

If we put a kid who's never driven a car behind the wheel for a daily commute, it's gonna feel pretty challenging for the kid.

Same goes for the first few months of any new thing. I'd say it's only after the mechanical operation of the car becomes routine that the commute can truly be said to trivial. And I'd say that this is after the first point in Driving is achieved.

Smart 16-year-olds are not noticably better drivers than dumb adults. Experience counts here and I'd say that experience is modelled by a point or two in Driving.