D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I recently decided to expand my gaming palette from my BattleTech wargaming background up to an actual RPG. D&D 3.X was a fine choice but just didn't cater to all the different genres as much as I would like. D20 is awesome but just didn't feel right for many genres. I spent months researching different systems and in the end decided on GURPS.

During my research I fell in love with many different D&D products (Ptolus, Wilderlands Of High Fantasy, The Book Of Iron Might, Iron Heroes, Arcana Unearthed/Evolved, and many others) that I want so very much to play. No gaming system seems as robust and "ready to go" as GURPS does. Especially when converting material created for a game system other than GURPS.

I'm sure there are numerous D&D conversions out there for GURPS but I've only found one document so far. Can anybody link me to web sites, projects, forum threads, or even offer me up some feedback on the subject. I really want to concentrate my time and gain experience behind the wheel of one game system, so playing under D&D is very undesirable and I heavily prefer to play it under GURPS if at all possible. Any suggestions, feedback, links, etc... would be most appreciated.

EDIT

1. Added The List
2. My main interest at this point in time is finding a formula to convert D&D 3.X Monster Manuals 1-5, Fiend Folio 1 & 2, and a few other 3.X bestiary's to GURPS.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Have you checked out "Dungeon Fantasy"? It pretty much has everything you need, and while it's not exactly a simplified ruleset, the suggestions therein are easy for new players to pick up.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Indeed, GURPS Dungeon Fantasy:
http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/books/dungeonfantasy/

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I have a few D&D conversion guidelines for monsters. I did all of Dragonlance's draconians plus two D&D critters. Look for them on my website (it's in my signature). I'll be happy to answer any of your questions by email (it's in the contact section of my website).

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

No doubt there are plenty of fantasy resources for the gurps game system. I am looking for a method to directly convert, specifically anything D&D 3.X, to GURPS. Here is a list of what I have come up with already. The few conversions on the internet are far from complete. Most just offer a little bit of help. I can't believe nobody has made a D&D To GURPS Bible yet. I'd head such a project myself except that I've never played D&D. It's pretty hard to know if you've converted something correctly when your not sure how the game/setting is supposed to "feel" in the first place. Any other links, suggestions, feedback, etc... would be most appreciated ^_^

GURPS Products For Dungeon Fantasy
General Fantasy Theory
4E GURPS: Fantasy
3E GURPS: Fantasy Folk
4E GURPS: Magic
3E GURPS: Religion

Specialized Fantasy Theory
3E GURPS: Dragons
3E GURPS: Faerie
3E GURPS: Rogues
3E GURPS: Spirits
3E GURPS: Undead
3E GURPS: Warriors
3E GURPS: Wizards

Bestiary Products
3E GURPS: Bestiary
3E GURPS: Creatures Of The Night
4E GURPS: Creatures Of The Night: Volume 1
4E GURPS: Creatures Of The Night: Volume 2
4E GURPS: Creatures Of The Night: Volume 3
3E GURPS: Fantasy Bestiary
3E GURPS: Monsters (inspiration/possibly useful)
3E GURPS: Space Bestiary (inspiration/possibly useful)


Hack n' Slash/Ready For Immediate Use
4E Dungeon Fantasy 1: Adventurers
4E Dungeon Fantasy 2: Dungeons
4E Dungeon Fantasy 3: The Next Level
4E Dungeon Fantasy 4: Sages
3E Magic Items 1
3E Magic Items 2
3E Magic Items 3

Additional Reading (possibly helpful)
3E GURPS: Man-to-Man
3E GURPS: Orcslayer (Man-to-Man Adventure)


D&D/Dungeon Conversions On The Internet
Collective Restraint's D&D 3E Conversions
Converting D&D Modules To GURPS (Quickly)
D&D 3.5 to GURPS 4E Convertion
Dungeons & Dragons Monsters
It Came From The Forums (GURPS community bestiary)
The High Fantasy Project (3E bestiary conversions)

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Uh? I hoped something more exhaustive!
LOL

(That is a great list!)

Kmunoz, a fellow forum member, arranged, along with other participants around here a PDF Bestiary with many D&D creatures. It think it is called "It came from the forums". Check it if you can, it is a free resource, and it is good stuff.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Aren't Dungeon Fantasy PDFs 4th edition ?

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Yeah *smacks head*. Fixed =)

I added "It Came From The Forums" (thanks for letting me know about this Demonsbane) and "The High Fantasy Project"

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Converting D&D modules to GURPS:

http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread...hlight=convert

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Many thanks for the link. I added it to the list above. Anybody else have theories? My main interest at this point in time is finding a formula to convert D&D 3.X Monster Manuals 1-5, Fiend Folio 1 & 2, and a few other 3.X bestiary's to GURPS.

Everything else is primarily setting. As far as jobs and skills go, I want a career system (like Warhammer FRP) versus the D&D Class or GURPS Point based systems. It will still work off of advantages and disadvantages but skills will be unlocked after X points have been accumulated, instead of being purchased individually.

EDIT
After reading Collective Restraint's D&D 3E Conversions I can see that converting monsters from D&D requires not only a great amount of time (at least when working with the vast amount of material I had in mind) but more importantly an expertise, or at the very least a familiarity with, D&D itself. Looks like Fantasy under GURPS might be a great deal harder than I had hoped it would be. The lack of an extensive bestiary has me wondering if I should just learn to play D&D =(

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Is there a need for a GURPS Bestiary?

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I wrote these articles a while back when I was pretty much a GURPS newbie as well. One of the biggest mistake I did, count the number of points for critters. I think the best PDF you could read is Dungeon Fantasy 2 and look at the examples of critter writeups. Kromm did a fantastic job of making writeups quick and easy to do. You only need to calculate points if you want players to use these templates.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I have a fair amount of experience with D&D 3.x (earlier versions too) and Gurps and in my opinion there's no real reason to be "mechanically" accurate in converting from one to the other.

D&D monster stats are rather complex and finicky in system specific ways. Also, certain elements such as the CR system are about as broken as any piece of game mechanics I've ever seen.

What I invariably do when converting from D&D is that a D&D Orc (or dragon or whatever) becomes a Gurps Orc (or whatever) without ever trying to establish a statistical conversion.

If the monster doesn't have an obvious Gurps equivalent you look at the description and pick something similar.

D&D has a lot of monsters that are actually very similar except in one or two specific areas. In Gurps these end up being the same monster with one or two options in the write up.

For example, a Lacedon is basically a Ghoul that breathes water and swims as well as a regular Ghoul runs. In Gurps you just add "Lacedon, add Amphibious (10pts) and Doesn't Breathe:Gills (10 pts)" and you're done.

You almost literally _can't_ fill up a Gurps Bestiary to the same degree as a D&D one with meaningful content. It becomes obvious after a while that it's cut and paste with one or two lines altered.

Of course, a lot of this is how things were done in D&D 1e Monster Manual before they discovered that you could sell endless books with near-clone (or pointlessly bizarre) monsters in them. You wouldn't actually need that huge list of monster books even if you were running straight D&D. I've certainly gotten by without them. Usually, anything that's not in MM 1 gets reprinted in the module using them.

While Gurps 4e has been very big on giving you "Templates" that would let you write up creatures using the full character creation system and the infinite variations that then become possible this would seldom be a good use of your time.

You really need very few stats to run a creature in Gurps combats. You need Attack Skill, Damage, Defenses (Dodge/ Parry/Block), DR Move, HP and HT and after yopu add notes for anythign really exotic (Insubstantial) that's really about it.

Sometimes having to figure these out by reading the Template instead of just reading them from a couple of lines of text is rather a nuisance but even that isn't really difficult.

So, when adapting a monster to Gurps, look at the description and then decide on that short list of stats I gave you and you're ready to go. You really, really do not need to convert all the monsters in all those books.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Outstanding! My lack of knowledge of D&D is really shining. I figured if they had 5 Monster Manuals then all were packed with completely original monsters. I want to run a Sword and Sorcery campaign and will need lots of cannon fodder so I figured they were the best route to go with. I really appreciate the feedback and for letting me know its not as big an undertaking as I was fearing. Thanks to everybody who offered me links and feedback. Very much appreciated ^_^

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

3E GURPS: Creatures of the Night and the shorter 4e volumes. These are full of *great*, original, very creepy monsters, good for horror as well as fantasy.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

A design goal for 3e was to have a monster of each type for each level of play. This means that there needs to be a few dragons, undead, demons, devils and so on that first level characters can face, ones that fifth level characters can face, ones that eighth level characters can face ... you get the drill. As such, there needs to be a certain amount of really redundant monsters to ensure a variety of challenges at all levels. Now, doing a bazillion monster books -- I count the five Monster Manuals, the Fiend Folio, and some others that are partly filled with new monsters (Complete Arcane, Miniatures Handbook, Libris Mortis, Draconomicon, Lords of Madness, Fiendish Codex I & II, and a bunch I am surely missing) -- has its virtues, and there are always nuggets of coolness, but don't assume it's needed, because it isn't. I've never owned more than the first of the five 3e Monster Manuals (though I did buy Complete Arcane and Libris Mortis for other reasons -- my favorite 3e character is a necromancer), and I've run dozens of D&D 3e sessions. Besides, plenty of GMs have fun adding class levels or templates to existing monsters to give their players a new thrill.

(FWIW, I actually prefer the approach of the last two Monster Manuals to explicitly present stats for a variation of an existing monster. I can't justify trying to find ecological niches for the various evil humanoids or using some of the odder monsters -- flumphs, anyone?)

Plus, Fred's right that if an adventure uses a foe not included in the main Monster Manual, then its stats are reprinted, though not other ecological or tactical information. Even then, most encounters use only the first Monster Manual.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I was aware of these but wasn't sure if they were really useful in a fantasy setting or not. I'm already spending a lot of cash getting other books so I was unsure, but based on your recommendations I'll go ahead and add them to my GURPS shopping list. Thanks for the referral ^_^

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

If you really are going for a D&Desque campaign, Dungeon Fantasy 1&2 are a must.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

You actually gave me another project idea. Convert all the D20SRD monsters into GURPS using the DF creature template format. A lot of them could be quick to do (like the ownbear, dire animals, etc.). I would get rid also of some stupid D20 designs. Like the Balor demon, look at it's skill list: +30 on Move Silently ? He's 12' tall and weights 4500 lbs for crying out out ! You should be able to hear him from quite a distance and god, I can't imagine a powerful demon like that resorting to sneaking. A demon like that doesn't even need to sneak, he should inspire fear to anyone who wants to oppose him. This is where GURPS shines compared to some of the D20 designs. Monsters with high Hit Dice are more skilled just because they are stronger ??? You'll see how much better your monsters will look like in GURPS.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

You'd be surprised, then, at how quietly some large animals can move. I've heard elephants, which weigh two or three times as much as that demon, make less noise walking around than I do. Granted, it seems odd that a big, bad demon might want to be stealthy (I think that's more an anti-PC device than an indicator of how they think), but the ability isn't actually unreal just because of their size.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Well, do check out the 4e PDF samples; you can see a couple of the monsters, see if they're to your taste. They lean more toward "Why are the people in the village turning grey and talking gibberish?" adventures than "Apply fireball; repeat."

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

The main reason I turned to D&D for converting a bestiary in the first place was because of the depth of their bestiaries. Most major product lines don't have large bestiary's. In fact most have 20 to 40 monsters and many of those are well known plants or slight variations on earth animals. Now that I know D&D bestiary is slightly modifying a monster, giving it a new name and new art, and attempting to pass it off as an original monster, I'm guessing D&D isn't much different than most other games; 20 to 50 original monster designs (monster manual 1).

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I understand what you mean, but then having a big burly demon like that stealthier than a 20 Dex, 10th Level, Elven Thief with maximum ranks in Move Silently is just wrong.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I don't think I've ever seen a 20th level rogue with a Dex that low, elf or not. The sort of builds I see would have something like:

Dex 17 (base) + 5 (level adds) + 4 (wish) + 6 (gloves) = Dex 32 (+11)

Move Silent: 23 (ranks) + 11 (Dex) + 5 (Boots or armour) = +39

For a stealth optimised build, add +2 - +5 for feats and class abilities and another +5 or +10 for using better Move Silently boosting armour, for about +46 to +54. With starting Dex 18 and being an Elf add another +2 (though this assumes blowing cash on another wish as well). Move Silent +30 is about what I'd expect from a rogue for ~15th level that had maxed out their MS ranks, but hadn't gone all-out in stealth.

Edit: Also, a Balor gets +7 of that just from Dex - their Dex is as high as that of a 20th level elf that started with max Dex (20), assuming no wishes or magical gear - they are inhumanly dexterous.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Yeah, too dextrous for my tastes. And they got that big Dex boost from 3e to 3.5e... And I thought 3.5e was actually supposed to fix things that weren't done properly in 3e :) I'll have to look at my books but I'm 99% sure that the 3e Balor's Dex was wayyyy lower.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Like making friggin' Balrogs, erm, sorry, Type VI Demons, oops, "Balors" too easy?

But we're talking about creatures of shadow (well, and fire, but let's disregard that for once) here, so his stealth skills should probably be based on supernatural abilities rather than simple DX. For some kind of reason, D&D designers are rather conservative when it comes to skill bonuses...

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Converting anything to GURPS, I would recommend you read the fluff, ignore the crunch.

By that, I mean don't worry about working out an exact conversion. If a monster is tough in D&D, make it tough in GURPS. Other than that, just throw together stuff that feels right based on the description.

I tried a direct conversion with Shadowrun, and I found I had done a lot of unnecessary work that didn't make the game any more fun than if I had just run a G: Cyberpunk/Technomancer game set in Seattle WA.

D&D does have some really nice fluff to build on, The Dungeon Fantasy series will certainly make it easier to use your stack of D&D books.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

Yes, got to have fluff in character, creature, artifact, etc. descriptions. I find it difficult to use a lot of conversions as written because they're all crunch with no hooks, background, ecology, or biggest turn-offs.

For example, the other day I was looking at D&D creatures converted to Mutants & Masterminds (which is not just tweaking; M&M has no hit points but a soak mechanism). They were all stats and powers. For someone not totally familiar with D&D monsters, one would need to put the conversion together with the fluff from the SRD or someplace else to get a complete picture.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

I think that is the path to follow.

Of course, if you are a Balor, you could walk that path really sneaky ^_^

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

This is why I wrote my D&D 3.5 to GURPS 4.0 conversion the way I did. Just enough "crunch" that you have a rough idea what you are doing but no so much as to overwhelm you.

Re: D&D 3.X Under GURPS: Links, Info, Feedback - Have Any For Me?
 

This is why I wrote my
D&D 3.5 to GURPS 4.0 conversion the way I did. Just enough "crunch" that you have a rough idea wha tyou are doing but no so much as to overwhelm you.