DF: Artificers?
 

I'm trying to think of fun things to do with Artificers in Dungeon Fantasy. Magic has a whole section on Alchemy to give ideas for potions and charms, and that's great for Artificers, but Artificers can also make engineering gadgets, and I'm not sure what to do with those. It doesn't seem quite right to let DF Artificers make machine guns, flame throwers and other typical "Quick Gadgeteer" stuff. Are there any resources to give ideas for what to do with low-tech Quick Gadgeteers? Simply using Quick Gadgeteering to jury-rig copies of low-tech equipment like crossbows or other DF1 stuff seems like a waste of a good advantage.

-Max

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

There are tons of things you can use

• Lock Picking gadgets

• Trap Disarming gadgets

• Wall Jacks (like a car jack just longer)

• Spring loaded "crossbow"

• Grappling Hook, rope and spool for the above

• Hand pump "Holy Water" sprayers (like the kind used in the 1920's for insect repellent)

• Pulleys

• Money Box that counts the group treasure when you place it in the slot

• Compass

• Spy Glass

• Extendable Rope Bridge

Thats all I can think of at the top of my head at the moment. I'm sure other forum members could expand this list as well.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Hmm. Okay, that's a start. Looks like it's going to be mostly miscellaneous, problem-specific stuff that's mostly dependent on the player's creativity. E.g. you need to cross a chasm, and you just killed a giant eagle--Gadgeteer says, "Hey, I can make a hang glider from the eagle's feathers!"

-Max

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Not to mention and Artificer should be able to come up with some traps of their own. No more running into the monsters when you can have them chase you to thier DOOM!

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

About the one thing that disappointed me when I saw the artificer was that I half-expected a D&D style artificer capable of creating temporary magic items on the fly.

Still, I love the DF Artificer all the same. I love gadgeteers.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

"normal" gadgeteers operating in a TL 8 game make TL 8 (or 9ish) stuff. Shifting down to TL 3(ish) means you should be looking at TL 3-5 stuff, although feel free to stretch that a little with the inclusion of alchemical materials.

"Flamethrowers" aka fire syphons are TL 2, IIRC - they were used historically. Iron "bomb" grenades, molotov cocktails and other interesting incendiaries are definitely in-scope, although they'd depend on alchemy instead of chemistry in a DF setting.

I've had PC's mix up a blend of water and lamp oil to try to float flammables down into monster burrows before setting them on fire - this kind of slightly hare-brained scheme works better when you're a gadgeteer for sure.

Clockwork automata to distract stupid monsters briefly or set off traps? Bracing unstable mine shafts or designed-to-collapse trap rooms. Bridging chasms (or hang gliding over, as you noted!). Parachute cloaks.

Just about everything in the Special Orders section of DF1 and DF4 is a candidate for gadgeting up.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

That's exactly what I was aiming for. Artificers aren't really supposed to revolutionize the setting's technology or retire on earnings from patents. I hinted that there are people like this in town but that the artificer PC differs from these in that he revels in solving problems on the fly instead of inventing the big stuff. It's the "wizard vs. enchanter" distinction all over again, but in the context of technology rather than magic. Put another way, artificers are MacGyver, not Captain Nemo.

I wasn't even aware that there was such a thing until I read this post a day after I had written the first draft of DF 4. I was using the more usual English-language definition of "artificer" ("a skilled craftsman or inventor").

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Slightly off topic: The Next Level notes that Artificer Bards can take Equipment Bond (musical intruments). The emphaisis is the author's. Implicit there is the idea that straight out Bards cannot have an instrument with which they know so well they get a bonus when playing it. B.B. is going to be Soooooooooooooooo disappointed about Lucille if that's true.

;)

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

It doesn't seem like a big stretch to allow Bards to have a like Equipment Bond.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Nothing says that ordinary bards can't have this. The emphasis is there to indicate "Well, here's something cool about this combo!" Artificers have EB on their template already, while bards do not, so it's more readily an option for artificer-bards. For plain old bards, this would constitute a little cross-training in the spirit of DF 3 but not an impossibility.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Duly noted. And frankly, I do think this version fits the term better. For Eberron-style "artificers", perhaps a Gadgeteering/Gizmo variant on the Enchanter would work.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

OTOH, some recent "dungeon-delving" gaming has dealt with limited steampunk technology, usually of dwarfish, goblin, or gnomish design. I would have liked the Gadgets chapter to have covered that topic as well as what it did cover, with advice on how to keep steampunk delvers from dominating the game while at the same time keeping them viable.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Well . . . steampunk tech is its own topic. However, as I loathe steampunk myself*, it won't be a topic I write about when the boss gives me a week or two to write something for fun.

--

* Not all steampunk -- just steampunk in fantasy.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Fair enough.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

And maybe I lied, because then I went and said that TL(3+1) and TL(3+2) would be interesting power-ups for artificers. Thinking about it more, maybe there would be ways to do that without it being strictly "steampunk." For instance, I like the idea of TL3 diverging by one or two TLs not because of what I feel is out-of-idiom Industrial Age speculative technology, but as a direct result of alchemy, magical materials, and spells. Hm.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

You've just described Eberron, BTW.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

I agree with the idea of techno-magic engineering, and I've had a few ideas along those lines myself. Just for one exemple: A horseless chariot driven by a clockwork engine, powered by the Propel spell. ...And why not a clockwork motorcycle, while we're at it?

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

In a dungeon?

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

Dungeon Artificer fits in real well with what I do with the Iron Kingdoms setting, as does the Scholar. My thanks.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

...Well, okay, maybe not in the dungeon...

A simpler idea I had was for an Artificer/Wizard with Machine Control/TL3 or 4 at level 20, using it as a kind of "Mental Interface" for portable mechanisms, like a wrist-mounted grappling hook launcher, or a clockwork mechanical arm carried on a portable mount, to serve as a third arm.

Re: DF: Artificers?
 

They're adventurers (people who love adventuring), rather than industrialists (people who love or want to earn money) or crusaders (people who want to inflict large-scale change on the setting).