GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3: The Next Level is available now in e23:

http://e23.sjgames.com/item.html?id=SJG37-0305

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

EDIT, 3 minutes later: IT IS MINE And just in time for something to read on the commute home. Great!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Excellent. Will probably pick this up over the weekend.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Saw it, bought it, read it, recommend it! Looks good. Nice sets of races and cross-classings.

Includes a new "skill". :P small surprise there in the end... something for the DnD ranger lovers!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

This is the new Unearthed Arcana for Dungeon Fantasy. Very cool. Just printed.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Printing. Can't wait.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Woo Hoo! *Dances a Happy Jig*

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Sweet. Nice to have a new item on my computer =). Ill send it off to kinkos next week for printing and binding =)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Fantastic. Awesome. Great. Love it.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Cha-ching, babeh!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

'tis mine, though I know not why.

I've read it and didn't find a single thing I found useful. Multiclassing rules? In GURPS? And the reason why we can't just buy some of the abilities of a different template?

The racial templates were... well, racial templates for Dungeon Crawling. Simple, direct and could have been whipped up for any player who wanted one in about 1-2 minute each. Don't get me wrong, I do believe in getting game designers to do my dirty work so I can focus on more fun stuff, but the point is that all of these templates fail to simulate the races in question well enough for me to bother with them. I want more detail in templates, not less. The only GURPS books with templates that I've found satisfactorily in the least was the 3e Special Ops and maybe a couple of Hans' work in 4e.

I loved the advice on running dungeon crawls in installments 1 and 2. I didn't find anything useful in the short postscript for advancement here. Plain vanilla we could have done ourselves.

Where were the complex Advantage sets set up to simulate various high-level abilities? They could have been here, but instead we get Two-Weapon Fighting which turns out to be Dual-Weapon Attack at maximum level + the Off-Hand Weapon Fighting Perk. With enough knowledge to run even a simple game, we knew that. I want someone to do the math and write-out for a Powers-style Meteor Swarm (because GURPS magic doesn't have anything like it), Sense Secret Doors (Dungeon Fantasy style), Stonecunning, Wall of Force/Iron/Stone. I can do all of that, but it requires some time and math, whereas Two-Weapon Fighting doesn't.



The only thing I did enjoy was the writing style and light-hearted approach.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

w00t!!!! Loving the DF series! Downloaded #3 w/in 19min of its release!
Have now the tools I need to truly enjoy the dungeon Z is planning. I shall be a Nymph Swashbuckler/<something magical>.

And this has much help potential for getting some characters that I like that are unfun for being AD&D characters and me no likey AD&D combat, so it's convertin' time!!

Ok, random excitement partially caused by sugar rush ended. I now return you to regularly scheduled thread.

Many praises to almighty Kromm for it's writing and the mighty SJ for its publication.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Icelander, that was a very scathing review. While I feel that you may have ruined this for me before I ever actually read the supplement, I do have to admit that at least your points were logical and explained well... >.>

Just want to say that before I strangle you for ruining it for me before I even read it.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I remain unaffected and happy. I think DF 3 remains in line with what I expected.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Maybe we should burn the heretic? Just a little? Maybe only around the edges? Maybe we'll get CP for it :D
(sorry Icelander. I'm in a weird mood)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

The first one. I'm working in a Powers-style Meteor Swarm for that... just give me time ;P

LOL

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Before you lot start banging flints and looking for good fa--ots for the fire, let me say that I'm sure the book is useful to someone. Someone entirely new to GURPS might get use from it, for example, and my room-mate, who is trying to learn the rules, might try to use it to run a simple Dungeon Crawl.

But I didn't see anything in DF:3 I could use, unlike the first two installments. Hence my disappointment.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

hmmmm.... perhaps we should drop the burning charges and reduce them to light torture until The Light is seen?

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Beware: it contains small parts (p. 8)! You are warned.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

It's Tiny Tools not small parts. I'm on pg8 right now... well... Z is. I'm impatiently waiting for threads to be posted in that I'm keeping up with.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Let me think...

• GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 1 = 29.5 pages *
• GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 2 = 30.0 pages *
• GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 = 42.5 pages *

Add this up and you have 102 pages. Now... take GURPS Lite, modify it so that all elements of the templates listed in the series (every skill, advantage, etc. listed in the three volumes) is covered at a minimum level... let'a call this 48 pages.

This makes 150 pages... which is a respectable sized book... and could be made as a POD volume. Heck, it could be made as a limited edition, small-hard-cover volume -- DUNGEON FANTASY (Powered by GURPS).

I know I'd buy it.




* This does not include the cover page, and the "e23 ad" at the end.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Indeed. Not for use by children under 3 ;P

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My pardon. I wasn't watching that thread. Didn't catch the joke.
Anyone noticed the thing about the trolls' hair?

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I'll grab this tomorrow, but one thing caught my eye in the sample PDF: the "Coleopteran" nonhuman race. If I'm not mistaken, that's the scientific term for the beetle family. Do I detect just a hint of Mieville?

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I loved it, personally. There might not have been anything in there I couldn't have figured out on my own, but heck, that's true for most GURPS genre books. I figure that the whole point of products like this is for those of who, for whatever reason -- in my case laziness -- don't want to do all the work ourselves.

And Dravenloft likes it because Kromm's racial templates are cheaper than mine were.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Need to get a new pack of paper...


Grumble. Neat trick. The Scout-Swashbuckler and the Swashbuckler-Scout are quite different. ;)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

If you can cut out some of Lite and get it to 144 pages, printers will be happier. And if you drop Lite and add a few other goodies, more equipment a few other templates and lenses and make it 128 pages, printers are happy and the price shouldn't exceed that of GURPS Mysteries POD.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

All I'm gonna say is that my Leprechaun Charms are Mass Zombie, Volcano, and Burning Death.

I -ing dare you to come after my lucky charms.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

How many racial templates did you yourself design? Me? I kind of can see some uses for those races.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

And some of them can be used too (besides as monsters) as a sort of baseline & starting point for developing races or creatures with more detail if I want to add some dimension for a Fantasy campaign with some Dungeon Fantasy elements.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Can one even set a phaser to "simmer?"

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Perhaps . . . but it took weeks to do, so I'm guessing that those who think their time is worth more than, say, 10 cents/hour will get their money's worth out of it. And hey, it's $7.95 despite being 12-13 pages longer than the other two, so if you don't think templates are worth as much, well, you didn't pay as much for them. FFI, though, DF is intended to be template-driven, so future items will only have more templates, lenses, and advancement options. If you have time for freeform points, you don't need DF.

Probably never in the DF series. It's commited to the magic-as-spells approach, and saves powers for "innates."

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No... Wait, this shouldn't be... We need the mind control lasers *working*!

;P

Icelander: my friend, I feel DF 1-2 and 3 are at last the GURPS affectuous embrace to the good & old dungeon crawl game we all know, and for me, Sean did it in a beautiful manner.

I'm waiting for further installments.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Oh, lord I've been busy lately, but since I saw this release I went ahead and bought it for a bit of recreational reading.

and nearly spit out my coffee. Hilarious.

But do half-elves kick bunnies because they don't get elven gear, or do elves not give them elves gear because they kick bunnies? The world may never know...

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Errata, Corpse Eater description, pg 6

Bold added to indicate possible errata. I assume that they need to eat sapient flesh, not sapients who are still alive flesh? Otherwise corpse eater is something of a misnomer.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Hmmm Elven Rabbits, taught in the ways of Bun Fu. Experts in the way of the 'fast one', able to use 'pronoun trouble' to devasting effect on their foes then ballet leap into their rabbit holes.

At last! The Zen of Bugs -- EXPLAINED!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Well, I consider a 1982 game of In the Labyrinth to be my first experience with GURPS so I am somewhat experienced and I'm going to get a lot of value out of this product. For example my players always try to argue racial templates down to zero points. This puts that little munchkinism to rest.
I haven't had a chance to give it a good read yet but it looks like the product is exactly as described on the tin.

Damn you Turhan! Now I wanna end with "Use only as directed. See a physician if symptoms persist more than 24 hours."

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Change their diet from flesh to Brains of recently deceased sapients and you have a workable 4th version of Fantasy Folk Ghouls. Without the headaches of 'they reproduce normally - but that doesn't mean that they aren't undead!"

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

And has the peculiarity of making most weapons inferior to unarmed attacks for SM -4 and smaller (I don't *think* the rules are supposed to apply to punches, kicks, bites, scratches if a small creature has claws, and so on), so I'm thinking of working up an alternate approach that is multiplicative (or divisive, depending on how you look at it) rather than subtractive. Probably do the same while I'm at it for armor...

I want those Lilliputian weapons to hurt at least a *little* bit if they hit bare skin!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

The part that did it for me was the image of the Halfling Cosa Nostra whacking their enemies, then enjoying a plate of spaghetti. Heh. Shades of Finieous Fingers and the Halfling Thieves' Guild.

Actually, why not a Finieous Fingers campaign? I've got the collection around somewhere...

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

As long as they're fairy made they (mostly) do - the minimum basic damage for non-crushing damage is one point, so as long as the weapon doesn't have a DR multiplier it'll do at least one point of damage.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

How about this as a fairly rough cut - for both DR and weapon bonus damage, multiply by the factors given for each SM below. Round to the nearest whole number, with 0.5 getting rounded down. Therefore:

SM Factor Bonus/DR: 1 2 3 4 5 6
-1 2/3 1 1 2 3 3 4
-2 1/2 0 1 1 2 2 3
-4 1/5 0 0 1 1 1 1
-6 1/10 0 0 0 0 0 1

Neither weapon damage bonus nor DR drops below 0.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Living is as contrasted with unliving, like a machine, not as contrasted with dead.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

So far I've done several different elven ones, a dwarven one, gnomish and orcish (two). Just what's needed for my current fantasy game. But that's detailed templates, whereas simplistic templates like that I've probably done in hundreds (usually in my head).

You see, the night before DF 3 came out, my room-mate, who wants to learn the GURPS rules well enough to run a simple pick-up game (after only about a decade of gaming), which would probably be similar to Dungeon Fantasy, he was trying to come up with templates for a 'typical' kobold, goblin, orc, gnoll and bugbear. Total time required to come up with templates (at least as detailed as the DF-ones) was less than ten minutes and that included GM-ing tips on how to run the individuals involved and how to give them skills according to their station in life.

Basically, coming up with simplistic templates like this isn't the challenge of GMing Dungeon Fantasy. Coming up with Advantage write-ups for the complex powers which often characterise monsters and PCs in them is several orders of magnitude more time-consuming than racial templates and I guess I was hoping for more 'High-Level' stuff in the book. You know, modified Advantages to simulate popular D&D feats, with all the modifiers worked out for me. That would have been useful, since that would have saved me actual work, instead of saving me having to think for a few seconds what Attribute modifiers a given race has.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I can see some of your points Icelander, however there are a few people (like myself) that are still just starting off in GURPS and my Fantasy Campaign is not 100% finished yet. GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 is a great resource for those of us that do not have a fully flushed out campaing world. I may not use every racial template but I will be using several of them.

A nation of Ghouls plays heavily in my campaign so the Corpse-eater was a great treat for me. I'm still waffling on wether to allow Elves and Dwarves in my fantasy world.

So from my perspective DF3 is a good resource, not as useful as DF 1&2 but it was worth the price I paid for it and I hope to see more in the series soon.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Yeah, except people who complained about the lack of races in Adventurers couldn't even be bothered to look up the elven and dwarven template in the core book, let alone make up their own.

It looks to me like DF: 3 was made to address what some felt were shortcomings. Most complaints about DF was that it didn't dumb things down enough, so perhaps Kromm is making life even easier for our "grab'n'go" GURPS players (as opposed to us who love to sit around tinkering)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I like the racial templates. I am almost certainly not going to use them as written, but they are very useful to me as examples of how to do various things mechanically. To be perfectly frank, while I have been playing GURPS for a long time, I am not very technically minded. I like to invent my own stuff, but it isn't always immediately obvious to me how to translate my ideas into crunch. These help a lot.

Also, given what kind of series DF is, they were needed. A player who builds their PC by choosing a profession template also needs to be able to just slap on a racial template and go.

I would love a PDF dealing with fantasy "powers".

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

+1



+10 characters

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I could say the same; I have been working on Forgotten Realms racial Templates.

But still it is nice to have those templates in DF 3 for other GM´s in the group and or when time is short and I as a GM don’t have time to build templates.

Also those Cross-Class templates help some players in my group that don’t have the time to build a complete character from scratch.

Now just for curiosity! What would DA 4 have?

I mean there is not much left is there?

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1) Monsters, monsters, monsters. You can never have too many monsters. Granted, that may overlap with the CotN series or Bestiary stuff.

b) Treasures. Stacks of pre-built magical and expensive mundane items or a random treasure generation system.

iii) Traps. Maybe not Grimtooth-style no-save death traps, but a list of prefab pits (say, a table which sets out how how much damage you take after falling x yards onto a surface of type y rather than requiring the GM to do the math each time somebody falls down), snares, alarms, hidden crossbows, and the like could be useful.

four) Random dungeon generation.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Will they have tips on how to number things as awesomely as you do?

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I second every single one of these suggestions. I'd go with the Beastiary and Treasures first, leaving traps for last.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I got 3 in now.

I'll have to politely disagree with Icelander, for my own personal use, in that it does seem very useful.

However, I cannot disagree that *Icelander* doesn't find it useful for *his* game, just saying... me likey!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Again SJGames, thank you for another amazing release! :)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

While I understand Icelander's objections, I've spent the last month and a half angsting over how I'd write up basic Dwarf and Elf racial templates.

A MONTH AND A HALF. It only took 5 minutes each to whip up a template for each, but then I'd add one thing. Take another thing away. Lather, rinse, repeat. Compounded with the fact that I'm not actually planning on running with a very specific game world and therefore don't have a particularly clear vision of how these races should look, this resulted in the dwarves and elves evolving laterally, in some cases coming full circle back to my original template (briefly, before being edited again).

Considering that I don't really have a specific game world in mind, DF3 has made me 10x happier. No decisions to make on the details! Just yank some approved templates from the book, and go!

The class lenses are actually doubly helpful, because while I'm allowing off-template character creation, the lenses are sort of "Class concept X, distilled" or "Class concept X, lite" and handy for the the off-template players. They remind me of the old 3e character concept "templates" - a list of suggestions for an archetype rather than the more modern guides.

So while I can see that Icelander didn't find the book particularly helpful, I humbly submit that many many people, experienced GURPSers or not, WILL find it helpful.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

It would be nice to see some more magical treasures of Kromm's design. He has dropped hints of the kind of stuff he plants in his own games before, like these.

A lot of the things from Magic Items 1, 2, and 3 would fit in fine in a DF campaign.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I'm personaly hoping that Sean will get his cinematic uber-fantasy improv. kicks out of DF and treat us to some more detail and crunchy bits in books like Thaumatology, Low-Tech (or whoever's writing them...).

Personaly I don't think I'm getting these, precisley because I don't need it. Got a good kick out of DF1 though, specially the Power Investure spell examples (for Druids and Clerics) and the equipment customization options.

There's a big market and low cost to translate these DF books to portuguese though... if only you guys get Basic through Devir (ok... can I rant about it now? Or are they still having trouble?).

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Sure, but it would be better to direct your rants at folks who can actually do something about it -- i.e. Devir themselves.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I was waffling on starting a Dungeon Fantasy campaign, even with the awesomeness of DF1 and DF2, but DF3's surprise visit has pushed me over; I will begin prepping a campaign and seeking out players in the Albuquerque area promptly!

I gather some people thought this supplement wasn't too useful (cough >Icelander< cough) but it was pretty much everything I wanted that was missing from DF1 and 2......booya! I especially love Kromm's take on dungeon fantasy (like the Dark Ones, for example...blending Dark Elves with Cthulhoid thingies, genius!)

Anyway...

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

What next? Honestly you could go on with this series for quite some time!

Dungeon Monsters
Traps and Treasures
Dungeon Societies
Dungeon Design

Slightly off topic but I'd like to see some GURPS Adventure series like this. Right now I just get the Goodman Games Dungeon Crawl Classics and then convert them to GURPS.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I mentioned it because in a previous thread Sean told me that Devir had received him very well and assured him that they had some sort of technical problem that delayed translations. At the time I was suggesting SJGames switch distributors/translators in Brazil, but Kromm put me at ease.

However, it's been ages since that post (who had been preceded by ages since launch of Basic Set) and still nothing. To me it either sounds like Devir's being unprofessional or can't handle your product... meanwhile you could be making some money here... there's a lot of GURPS Players, and not all of them know english at a technical enough level.

A lone translator would have been done by now. Rest assured that I do bug them about it, as do many... but it's as innefective as they are. Anyways, sorry for posting off-topic and ranting, just thought that I should voice the frustration that some brazilian players have with your chosen partner... and I think it's the sort of thing you should know.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

A bunch of replies . . .

Precisely. The biggest single complaint about DF 1 was "Where are the nonhuman races?!", with an honorary mention for "Where are the rules for evil clerics?!" The biggest single complaint about DF 2 was "Where are the rules for xp and advancement?!", with an honorary mention for "Why didn't we get a basic orc or ogre?!" DF 3 completely addresses all of this. While some gamers regard racial templates, character templates, and GMing advice as "trivial," "not crunchy bits," and/or "unnecessary" . . . just as many or more do not.

And that's the other thing. Just because you could make something up in a few minutes doesn't mean you'll find it easy to play grab-and-go games with it. Many gamers desire an "approved," "canonical," or "official" baseline. They like to know that "elf" means these traits and that "bard-swashbuckler" means these abilities.

Remember that I designed DF as a light game, not as a design aid for really geeky, established players. My goal was to enable a GM to say, "I'm running DF by the book tomorrow. Anything created with the standard character and racial templates is cool. Stuff on the official gear list is fine. See you here at 2 p.m." Freeform point-build is a wonderful thing in GURPS but also very GM-intensive.

As for powers . . . flashy, magical powers are going to be spells in this series. That's just how I want DF to work. I can write examples of abilities for powers. I'm just not doing it here. Those who want to see Kromm play with powers should get Powers, wherein I demonstrate that I can design hundreds of abilities and make you bored long before I get bored. ;)

Indeed, I am writing a fourth, shorter item as we speak and have a fifth one I'd like to do. Another SJ Games illuminatus is gearing up to write something for the series. Two established e23 writers are working on outlines. There is interest. :D

It's possible. It's really hard to say. There could also be perfectly valid financial reasons for it. Goodness knows that SJ Games has had to cancel products and licenses over the almighty dollar.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I'm very happy with DF3. While I see some validity to the argument that you could do everything there yourself, I think it misses the point. I've been a GURPS player and GM for almost 20 years and I think that pre-made templates and lenses are some of the best things to happen to the system. The DF series, as a whole, is superb. Keep up the good work, Dr. Kromm!

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Hey, great! Thank you once again for personally continuing the work in the series.

So, we can wait for another DF installment (the fourth) soon!

That is good news, too.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I think DF3 is an important addition to the line. I certainly agree that if you have the time to do the entire thing free form points then this book is not all that necessary, but that isn't the point of the series. The entire idea is that is captures the essential essence of old school dungeon fantasy games without old school clunky mechanics (GURPS instead of course).

Basically this addition is everything I as GM would like to have in my back pocket for the game. Sure, most of it will not come into play in any single game. But it would take me a while to write it all up, especially for it NOT all to come up in a game. But it is absolutely worth $7.95 to have all that tucked away in the GM notebook to any kind of combination the player wants, BOOM, I know its there and don't have to think much more about it.

There are two areas where I though it let me down (only a little bit).

The first was experience points. Kromm mentioned something about character advancements in another thread and I was hoping for something more. Not sure what exactly, but the couple paragraphs on altering giving out CPs was nothing huge in my opinion.

The other was the "Power-Ups". I love the idea. I think they are supposed to represent the major new abilities classic dungeon fantasy characters get. I would have loved to see it expanded upon even more.

Bottom line though, a great thing to have in the GM's (or can we actually DM in this instance since it is dungeon fantasy?) notebook.

I am also extremely glad to here that there are more volumes planned. I agree with the above suggestions on topics. There are a few more staples of classic dungeon fantasy that have yet to be addressed.

I look forward to picking them up.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

True. And now, DF as a whole looks better rounded and providing a good enough baseline, both for GM/players running their own campaigns as for game designers wishing to work officially in the line.


I agree with this point because particular motives, too: I love GURPS at last making an approved and official take in the dungeon high fantasy genre. I was waiting for something exactly like this since I knew GURPS a bit earlier of the middle of the past decade, but finally I stop waiting: I thought such thing never was going to happen... It looked to me as if SJG were against the high fantasy genre as a whole, and the official and humorous Munchkin releases only strengthened my feelings.

Happily I was wrong!

The coming of 4e Fantasy was superb, and DF expands and rounds the things even more.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Based on my memories of truly classic DF, I guess I was expecting some more stuff along the lines of:

Once you accumulate a certain amount of wealth and/or experience, you start going into new areas entirely.

Knights and such start getting higher Status, more Allies and Ally Groups, and eventually build their own strongholds. Barbarians similarly get an opportunity to trod the earth beneath their sandaled feet by conquering whole nations.

Wizards lose most of their restrictions against Enchantment and Gate spells, and similarly may construct wizards' towers filled with apprentices or magical minions.

Martial Artists start to explore a whole new regime of powers under the Chi rubric.

Similarly Ally and stronghold additions for each template.

Maybe even some notes on the pathway to deification, including Semi-Divine and Divine 'racial' templates and both Good and Evil Divine Power write-ups.

But what we got was very good and useful, don't get me wrong.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I know that problem, oh how I know it. It's the primary reason my newish fantasy game ended up reusing the same world I've been using (with multiple groups, systems, and styles of game) for the past fifteen-odd years - I know it well enough to be able to define elfs, dwarfs, goblins, etc. easily without feature creep and concept dilution.

Agreed, though the elfs and orcs are of no use to me - they're too different from mine. However, a number of the other templates will be right handy.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I do rather like the Dark Ones, to the extent that I'm trying to work out a way of fitting them into my campaign.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Methinks you're having TOO much fun with this.

I like how you found a use for all the nifty old 3rd edition images. Heee.

Kromm, you're cool. (I don't worship, I praise)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I think that that sort of stuff is not really DF, and once a campaign moves in that direction it's time to crack out the main books and use them.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I'll agree on the first three, which all deserve their own books. The most important, monsters, would logically be DF4. Treasures isn't as much of a need since one could just use the generic magic items with each spell in GURPS Magic.

I want a GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Companion. In it, you would have templates for common NPC types and villains, and maps for common locations, and other things a GM would want at his fingertips.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I like these ideas.

Perhaps part of them would be suited for some future installments?

Good and useful, I agree. For me, Dungeon Fantasy, having right now 3 PDF in its line, is like being currently in a sort of "basic" stage. It can need to progressively grow to a sort of "advanced" scale. Who knows...


EDIT: But Rupert is right, too. These sort of advantages, traits, very well can be addressed with a normal (non-dungeon) Fantasy approach and the main books.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

That's all for the inevitable splats. ;)

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Do exists the possibility of we having some subtle hint about the nature of this fourth PDF?

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

It was badly needed and you dealt with this wonderfully. For someone looking for a quick template, there is a wide range of interestingly different alternatives - back in my old AD&D days, I would have killed for a selection like this to choose from. (More important for me, though, is that they provide useful examples of how to translate ideas into crunch).

Except for Bard-Song, Chi-Mastery, Druidic Arts, Holy Might, Unholy Might and Psionics. :)

You could keep going for a while as far as I am concerned. Powers is a brilliant book, but given the vastness of its subject matter and the large number of advantages and advantage-modifiers in GURPS, there is plenty of room for more.

That is great news! :) I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a DF: Monsters.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I'll be forthright and say that (1) one of the proposals from writers we trust is for DF N: Monsters but (2) N does not equal 4. Sorry about that, but monsters are stats-heavy, so that one will need a real playtest with a stats-checker, and have to be written on contract by somebody off the clock -- i.e., not me. My current project (which may or may not have N = 4, depending on other people) is more in the DF 1 & 3 vein, but with gear. For now, it's a secret. The longer one I really hope to write is more in the DF 2 vein.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

Sounds well! Thanks for the info.

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

I just finished reading DF3. Back at the beginning of the month I suggested DF: Rewards. Well, everything I wanted is here in DF3, it's like getting a second Christmas. I can't wait for Sunday. My players are going to be so whiny when they see all the cool stuff they don't have points for. I'm gonna be all, "Ha! You shoulda saved that princess instead of selling here to the evil cult, you'd have way more xp right now!"

Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3 now available!
 

To me, it's still DF, but maybe that's just because I remember the early Gygax-fueled days of yore, where guidelines as to how many followers you could get at what level and when you started to build your fortress were de rigeur. After all, the original DF game actually started out as a tactical miniatures wargame, promoting the thought that eventually your characters might be leading armies.