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-   -   Perk: Berserk. Your opinions? (https://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=30852)

mcv 09-11-2007 02:07 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran
I'ld call switchable callous almost normal for people. When one's life is truly in danger, it's amazing how much one suddenly doesn't care about others. Look at survivors' guilt and how badly they feel about crawling over the bodies of others trying to escape tragedy.
That's normal survival instincts. I think people with real switchable Callous won't feel guilt or crappy, but will still be normal well-adjusted human beings is normal situations.

I once heard that about 1% of the population is able to kill effectively in combat without hesitation or feeling bad about it. Of these, about half are real psychopaths who would also be able to kill people outside of combat, and are unable to see other people with a right to live, and the other half are what they called the "true heroes" or ideal soldiers, able to kill when necessary, but also able to feel compassion when necessary.

I think that's a bit what switchable Callous might be. Although I get the impression that it's actually a big and rare advantage, bigger than a perk.

Gef 09-11-2007 03:02 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
I think Perk (Berserk at Will) is fine. It's a bit more detailed than other Perks, but it's balanaced by the bad things that can happen once you go Berserk. In general I'd say any disadvantage becomes a Perk if it is switchable; e.g., Switchable Horizontal is a Perk that means you don't move any better on all fours, but unlike a man you don't slow down when you crawl. Switchable Deafness protects you against Rapier Wit, but you can't hear your buddies either, and of course you have to activate before the protagonist taunts you. -GEF

Flyndaran 09-11-2007 08:57 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcv
That's normal survival instincts. I think people with real switchable Callous won't feel guilt or crappy, but will still be normal well-adjusted human beings is normal situations.

I once heard that about 1% of the population is able to kill effectively in combat without hesitation or feeling bad about it. Of these, about half are real psychopaths who would also be able to kill people outside of combat, and are unable to see other people with a right to live, and the other half are what they called the "true heroes" or ideal soldiers, able to kill when necessary, but also able to feel compassion when necessary.

I think that's a bit what switchable Callous might be. Although I get the impression that it's actually a big and rare advantage, bigger than a perk.
The switchable part of callous means that when they turn it off they suffer the emotional repurcussions of their actions PAST and present.
I believe that your interpretation includes the lack of remorseful and empathy related disadvantages like pacifism and all its subsections.
I have painfully low empathy for humans, but a well developed sense of sympathy and honor, so I think I have a point of view that differs markedly from the mainstream.

Hannes665 09-11-2007 09:35 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icelander
I'd allow it without reservation.

Berserk state is dangerous enough so that it's unlikely to be unbalancing in any way.

Heck, I'd allow someone to take Berserk as Quirk, representing a Disadvantage without a self-control roll. That would mean that the character had a choice when to enter a rage, but he had to role-play the Quirk somehow.

A person whose not prone to Berserk rages but can if she wants to enter such a state sounds like someone with your Perk.
Yes I would think a Quirk version would be the best solution. Takes 1 turn of concetrate and you are in a berserk mode and require 1 turn of concetrate to calm down with out any will or self control roll required. I personaly would rule that the PC could not leave the Berserk mode unless he is not in direct combat with anyone at the moment he "leaves" his berserk rage.

Bruno 09-11-2007 10:01 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannes665
Yes I would think a Quirk version would be the best solution. Takes 1 turn of concetrate and you are in a berserk mode and require 1 turn of concetrate to calm down with out any will or self control roll required. I personaly would rule that the PC could not leave the Berserk mode unless he is not in direct combat with anyone at the moment he "leaves" his berserk rage.
A pc who is Berserking cannot take Concentrate actions, so that doesn't work as an exit condition...

I find it highly dubious to allow a player to exit Berserk at will - otherwise he'd only activate it whenever he would make an all-out-attack anyways, and just turn it off when he's done. The benefits in this case seem to be worth more than a perk.

Lonewulf 09-11-2007 10:08 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
A pc who is Berserking cannot take Concentrate actions, so that doesn't work as an exit condition...

I find it highly dubious to allow a player to exit Berserk at will - otherwise he'd only activate it whenever he would make an all-out-attack anyways, and just turn it off when he's done. The benefits in this case seem to be worth more than a perk.
What about the whole "don't go unconscious" thing? Wouldn't the player want to take advantage of that? Why would they only do it for all-out attacking...? o.O

vicky_molokh 09-11-2007 10:24 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Okay, assuming a perky berserker has an effective SC number, how high would you set the snap-out SC for the Perk? 12? 15? 18 but reduceable by various factors as usual?

vicky_molokh 09-11-2007 10:25 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonewulf
What about the whole "don't go unconscious" thing? Wouldn't the player want to take advantage of that? Why would they only do it for all-out attacking...? o.O
If you're Berserking you must AoA. And that calls for unconsciousness checks. Just taking Do Nothing manoeuvres doesn't call for such checks.

Lonewulf 09-11-2007 10:43 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Molokh
If you're Berserking you must AoA. And that calls for unconsciousness checks. Just taking Do Nothing manoeuvres doesn't call for such checks.
*ahem*

Quote:
Originally Posted by Basic Set pg. 124
You are immune to stun and shock, and your injuries cause no penalty to your Move score. You make all rolls to remain conscious or alive at +4 to HT."
Of course, I'm SURE that there's no advantages to that at all. Nope. You'd only use berserk for all-out attacking, ayup. ;)

And yes, I know that you have to roll unconsciousness checks. You told me something I already know -- yay! :)

Icelander 09-11-2007 10:48 AM
Re: Perk: Berserk. Your opinions?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonewulf
*ahem*

Of course, I'm SURE that there's no advantages to that at all. Nope. You'd only use berserk for all-out attacking, ayup. ;)
That wasn't what he meant. He was stating that one could only perform All-out Attacks when one was Berserking.

Yes, that state came with some benefits, but it did demand that one always All-out Attacked and never defended.


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